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+--- Thread: [SUGGESTION] Make weapons equally matched (/showthread.php?tid=55)
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RE: Make weapons equally matched - esteel - 04-05-2010
(04-05-2010, 11:38 AM)Roanoke Wrote: Rock paper scissors balance is something that I'm against. Each weapon should be good to counter other ones.
Actually i posted a good reason for this.. if you have weapons that shine in certain situations you get a certain flow and also get people to move and get those guns. If all guns are basicly good enough you get a hell of a boring game!
RE: Make weapons equally matched - Space Ace - 08-31-2010
Roanoke: "Rock paper scissors balance is something that I'm against. Each weapon should be good to counter other ones."
I agree with Roanoke
I find that they are nearly equally matched already.
The more powerful ones are not as fast or easy to use as other ones.
They each have their own benefit and drawbacks.
To use the nex gun, the best way is to stand still, zoom in, and that leaves your open to attack.
RE: Make weapons equally matched - AnArKiSt - 08-31-2010
(08-31-2010, 09:38 AM)Space Ace Wrote: I agree with RoanokeTag seeker seems to be the exception, though I doubt that's even considered a weapon.
I find that they are nearly equally matched already.
The more powerful ones are not as fast or easy to use as other ones.
RE: Make weapons equally matched - divVerent - 08-31-2010
(04-05-2010, 11:38 AM)Roanoke Wrote: Rock paper scissors balance is something that I'm against. Each weapon should be good to counter other ones.
MG shouldn't be replaced, just toned down. SG spread should be elevated, and then maybe we won't need to change the damage.
Nex should not have damage falloff, instead ~100 damage, but maybe push falloff.
I think the term "rock paper scissors balance" is not exactly right. Balance should indeed be Rock Paper Scissors-like in "total" weapon balance - but this only because on AVERAGE the weapons should be equally good. However, the strength variation of weapon vs weapon should not be too high. No weapon should entirely dominate another weapon.
However, in different SITUATIONS different weapons should shine. Rifle is for long range, for example. The "rock paper scissors" like table actually should have the weapon as rows, and the situation as columns!
RE: Make weapons equally matched - Space Ace - 10-18-2010
(08-31-2010, 09:58 AM)AnArKiSt Wrote: Tag seeker seems to be the exception, though I doubt that's even considered a weapon.
Which one is the TAG Seeker? What does it do?
RE: Make weapons equally matched - FruitieX - 10-18-2010
(10-18-2010, 04:55 PM)Space Ace Wrote:(08-31-2010, 09:58 AM)AnArKiSt Wrote: Tag seeker seems to be the exception, though I doubt that's even considered a weapon.
Which one is the TAG Seeker? What does it do?
It fires a "tag projectile", and if it hits a player, it then triggers the weapon to fire heat-seeking rockets towards this player.
RE: Make weapons equally matched - Rust Heart - 11-06-2010
Tag_N_Bag, for what it's worth I don't think you sound trolly and agree wholeheartedly that realism should be a far, far lower priority than fun.
I'm not against the rock-paper-scissors philosophy, but agree with divVerent that it's possible to do much better. Counters should never be reduced to which weapon is equipped, but rather any weapon can outperform any other if used in a situation more appropriate for it. In other words, instead of having a rock weapon, a paper weapon, and a scissors weapon, each pair has a relationship like the sniper rifle and shotgun: each is the hardest counter to the other, with the direction of the relationship being context sensitive. One really big thing I like in particular about this game is that there's no BFG or Redeemer, and the community seems interested in closing the desirability gap between the Nex and the other weapons.
I think in terms of niches in the ecosystem which weapons fill, and within any one of these roles each weapon should be as close to equally popular, desirable, and available as we can make them. Two niches I'm particularly interested in having the starting weapons fill, in addition to the movement tool, are the close defensive weapon and the general-purpose workhorse. They could be the same weapon, or different weapons. I think the Shotgun can easily become that, sorta like a diet version of Halo's original über-pistol but short-ranged instead of long-ranged. I know that's a totally different type of game but I think the idea fits the arena game well. Questioning the weak spawning weapon tradition seems to me a logical progression from dropping the superweapon tradition. IMO perfect weapon balance means you feel like you earned your frags and your opponents earned theirs, partly by using the right tool the right way, never that it's because one of you just spawned or just picked up the nuke.