+- Xonotic Forums (https://forums.xonotic.org)
+-- Forum: Support (https://forums.xonotic.org/forumdisplay.php?fid=3)
+--- Forum: Xonotic - Help & Troubleshooting (https://forums.xonotic.org/forumdisplay.php?fid=4)
+--- Thread: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way (/showthread.php?tid=3437)
Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - edh - 08-27-2012
Here's a fairly old time essay on how to ask for help on computer issues, where to post, what information to give, what etiquette to use. This may be useful in getting the best answer to queries you have on Xonotic:
http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
Sticky or add the link to another sticky topic perhaps?
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - rocknroll237 - 08-27-2012
Someone should make a video of this!
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - Mr. Bougo - 08-27-2012
I'd rather just ask people to use common sense (or make an effort at least). While I agree with its contents, this document is way too long and serious for this context IMHO.
I'll still sticky it, but I don't expect anyone to read it
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - PinkRobot - 08-28-2012
Also, calling anyone an idiot in the first paragraph when you're talking about netiquette makes me a bit skeptical about the rest of the document.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - asyyy - 08-28-2012
Wow that guy really wears his head below his belt.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - Mr. Bougo - 08-29-2012
You have to understand the context. In mailing lists, it's ok to insult your inferiors. That's how it is, and don't question it you #@?!ing *&@#.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - asyyy - 08-29-2012
Context? People who think they are ubersmart but yet are stuck in a crappy code monkey/sys admin function try to cure their frustrations and insecurity by building a scenario of outgroup discrimination which enhances their self-esteem on the costs of others.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - Mr. Bougo - 08-29-2012
That's pretty much where I was trying to go with my unapparent cynicism.
EDIT: Although, AFAIK, esr is kind of a big name in the FLOSS world. He must have seen his fair share of annoying users which made him rather cold.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - edh - 09-16-2012
Had a bit of a rethink about this, maybe something needed in companion to this would be How to Win Friend and Influence People:
Quote:Fundamental Techniques in Handling People
Don't criticize, condemn, or complain.
Give honest and sincere appreciation.
Arouse in the other person an eager want.
Six Ways to Make People Like You
Become genuinely interested in other people.
Smile.
Remember that a person's name is, to that person, the sweetest and most important sound in any language.
Be a good listener. Encourage others to talk about themselves.
Talk in terms of the other person's interest.
Make the other person feel important – and do it sincerely.
Twelve Ways to Win People to Your Way of Thinking
The only way to get the best of an argument is to avoid it.
Show respect for the other person's opinions. Never say "You're Wrong."
If you're wrong, admit it quickly and emphatically.
Begin in a friendly way.
Start with questions to which the other person will answer yes.
Let the other person do a great deal of the talking.
Let the other person feel the idea is his or hers.
Try honestly to see things from the other person's point of view.
Be sympathetic with the other person's ideas and desires.
Appeal to the nobler motives.
Dramatize your ideas.
Throw down a challenge.
Be a Leader: How to Change People Without Giving Offense or Arousing Resentment
Begin with praise and honest appreciation.
Call attention to people's mistakes indirectly.
Talk about your own mistakes before criticizing the other person.
Ask questions instead of giving direct orders.
Let the other person save face.
Praise every improvement.
Give the other person a fine reputation to live up to.
Use encouragement. Make the fault seem easy to correct.
Make the other person happy about doing what you suggest.
Softskills are if anything more missing from the Internet than hardskills and I would think that the authors of How to Ask Questions the Smart Way should have a think about it too...
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - asyyy - 09-16-2012
Doesn't that belong in WW?
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - Mr. Bougo - 09-16-2012
Define "that" ?
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - asyyy - 09-17-2012
That kind of checklist one would rather expect at yahoo answers..
If you disagree please explain which theory the "The only way to get the best of an argument is to avoid it." is grounded on for example. Or why "Dramatize your ideas." should be a good thing in a sane discussion.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - edh - 09-17-2012
(09-17-2012, 03:45 AM)asyyy Wrote: If you disagree please explain which theory the "The only way to get the best of an argument is to avoid it." is grounded on for example.
If you want something, it's better to persuade someone rather than arguing with them. Persuasion doesn't require anyone to get angry. If you know that someone else has a different viewpoint and isn't going to change then don't bother getting into an arguement with them because it will be futile.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - asyyy - 09-17-2012
Quote: If you know that someone else has a different viewpoint and isn't going to change then don't bother getting into an arguement with them because it will be futile.But what if they are right? Or more realistically, they have some valid points and so do you. Even if you don't manage to persuade the other party an argument still does have its use as it can bring up new information, new viewpoints or even clear up misunderstandings (you think you know their viewpoint, but what if you are wrong about that?).
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - edh - 09-17-2012
(09-17-2012, 06:30 AM)asyyy Wrote: But what if they are right? Or more realistically, they have some valid points and so do you. Even if you don't manage to persuade the other party an argument still does have its use as it can bring up new information, new viewpoints or even clear up misunderstandings (you think you know their viewpoint, but what if you are wrong about that?).
There's still no reason to argue then. Instead take the counsellor approach and ask questions to better understand their viewpoint. This will find everything that an argument will find and more and you're more likely to be friends with them at the end of it which helps in future.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - asyyy - 09-17-2012
If you don't bring up arguments, the other party can't react on them. Asking questions to inform yourself about the viewpoints of others is only one step in the process of arguing. I don't see what is wrong with having an argument, as long as it is about the subject in question and doesn't get personal.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - edh - 09-17-2012
It would be ironic for me to argue with you. ;-)
You have your view point.
RE: Useful Info: How to ask questions the smart way - machine! - 09-19-2012
Hmm, thanks for sharing edh, personally I've already read it, and many other of his guides, but it's great for people who don't know about esr's great guides.
and...
(08-29-2012, 06:37 AM)asyyy Wrote: Context? People who think they are ubersmart but yet are stuck in a crappy code monkey/sys admin function try to cure their frustrations and insecurity by building a scenario of outgroup discrimination which enhances their self-esteem on the costs of others.
He is "ubersmart", I don't understand the rest though....