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remaking final rage ........... - Printable Version

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remaking final rage ........... - hutty - 10-23-2012

as some of you may know ... I recently started remaking final rage ...
note ... this is a full remake ... not another retexture (like on the same lines as the current stromkeep vs the nexuiz one)

However I need input ...

Looks ...
Visual style is going follow to be a new texture pack I am working on ... there will be lots of hexagons ... and lots of leaves (grass trees other green things ...)
I am going to use tons of visual effects (avoiding particle, animated model, and reflection based effects for framerate reasons )

Layout ...
Map structure will change a little (over it will still be the same rooms an hallways ...) However hallway shapes will change a little ... I might expand a few of the rooms on the side to make room for more details and such ...
Weapon layout ... I HAVE NO IDEA .... I need to know whos layout to use ... and what goes where ... (from what I understand some people dont like the current layout )

Other things ...
I'm thinking of getting rid of the lava (I cant compile it anyways for some odd reason ...)
As a replacement ... in areas around certain important objects (like the megas, nex, hlac :3) there will be zelda style spikes embedded in the floor ... that will shoot out when someone shoots at a shootable trigger ...
This may possible add more dynamics to the fight ...

--------------------------------------------------------

un fortunatly I can't offer any screenshots at the moment ... my current progress map is a mess right now ...
I need your opinions on these things

NAME ... final-rage doesn't feel professional enough ...
LAYOUT ... what do you want
EFFECTS ... how much is too much ?
SPIKES .. good idea? or too gimiky ...
ANY OTHER ISSUES YOU HAVE WITH THE CURRENT FINAL RAGE


RE: remaking final rage ........... - Cyber Killer - 10-23-2012

Quote:lots of leaves (grass trees other green things ...)

I like this - the game could use some more organic stuff :-)


RE: remaking final rage ........... - srkdy - 10-24-2012

(10-23-2012, 05:19 PM)hutty Wrote: Layout ...
Weapon layout ... I HAVE NO IDEA .... I need to know whos layout to use ... and what goes where ... (from what I understand some people dont like the current layout )

I'm a big fan of layout changes in this post (http://forums.xonotic.org/showthread.php?tid=3599). Moving the teleporter, RL, Mortar and adding the 50a really changes the dynamic of the map and, imo, opens it up a lot more. The old layout always felt severely broken with the player in control having just about everything locked down.

(10-23-2012, 05:19 PM)hutty Wrote: Other things ...
I'm thinking of getting rid of the lava (I cant compile it anyways for some odd reason ...)
As a replacement ... in areas around certain important objects (like the megas, nex, hlac :3) there will be zelda style spikes embedded in the floor ... that will shoot out when someone shoots at a shootable trigger ...
This may possible add more dynamics to the fight ...

The lava on the map works as-is, especially with the 50a being where it is in the aforementioned layout changes.

The idea of spikes being triggered to me is a no-go. If they are low damage, then it's more worthwhile to deal damage with regular weapons. If they are high damage, then it enormously rewards simple timing. If the triggers are in a remote location, then you're rewarding players avoiding items, which is counter-productive in a game that flows around item pickups.

To be frank about it, a gimmick like this would likely make me put this map back into the "broken" category and I'd very rarely, if at all, play it.

(10-23-2012, 05:19 PM)hutty Wrote: NAME ... final-rage doesn't feel professional enough ...
EFFECTS ... how much is too much ?
ANY OTHER ISSUES YOU HAVE WITH THE CURRENT FINAL RAGE

I think the name and general style should be kept similar to the original, out of deference to the map's history. As far as effects go, I play with ugly settings... so it ultimately doesn't matter to me.


RE: remaking final rage ........... - kojn^ - 10-24-2012

Just to add. The layout of the original isn't the problem, it was the weapon/armour layout. I suggest you keep the layout the same, raise the corridor ceiling height ever so slightly and use the weapon/item layout of the version LO has done. Ofcourse also make it nicer if you think you can but don't change what isn't broken is the point i'm making if you want the map to be played.

If you can do this we will finally have a playable balanced version for duels.


RE: remaking final rage ........... - Mirio - 10-24-2012

(10-24-2012, 03:41 AM)kojn^ Wrote: Just to add. The layout of the original isn't the problem, it was the weapon/armour layout. I suggest you keep the layout the same, raise the corridor ceiling height ever so slightly and use the weapon/item layout of the version LO has done. Ofcourse also make it nicer if you think you can but don't change what isn't broken is the point i'm making if you want the map to be played.

If you can do this we will finally have a playable balanced version for duels.

Yeah, chain chain megas still then. ~.~


Still don't get why you want to remake it but whatever. Who needs a 4th (?) version of Final Rage. :|
Because if people like L0s version, they probably won't play yours (much).
IMO you should make your own Duel map (also hi contest)!
gl hf


RE: remaking final rage ........... - machine! - 10-24-2012

He actually have a VERY cool map WIP, it's on PS Duel Server!


RE: remaking final rage ........... - hutty - 10-24-2012

the way I see it is that the map lacks visual quality ... and is played alot...

My end goal is to have every map on the ps duel server to have a visual quality >= that of stormkeep ...
It is more of a bug fix (bug being the ugliness) than a strait out remake ...

also it makes a great starting point for the texture work I am doing
(I was originally going remake sunset ... but maddin might still be working on that ... and I didn't want to make him sad)

The spikes will be very high damage, and intended to add complexity so the person in control can just grab all the megas ... they have to be sure to be sneaky about it... If they don't work out in playtesting... I'll take them out

oh ... and that "very cool" map machine is talking about is a bluesky remake ... but it still needs to be scaled ... and is very gimmicky (lots of buttons)


RE: remaking final rage ........... - s1lence - 10-24-2012

IMO spikes are a bad idea, just use lava or the blue slime.

especially the blue slime.


RE: remaking final rage ........... - Mr. Bougo - 10-24-2012

(10-24-2012, 06:52 AM)Mirio Wrote: Yeah, chain chain megas still then. ~.~

Wot.


RE: remaking final rage ........... - Mirio - 10-24-2012

(10-24-2012, 12:33 PM)Mr. Bougo Wrote:
(10-24-2012, 06:52 AM)Mirio Wrote: Yeah, chain chain megas still then. ~.~

Wot.

You don't play. Tongue


RE: remaking final rage ........... - kojn^ - 10-24-2012

(10-24-2012, 12:39 PM)Mirio Wrote:
(10-24-2012, 12:33 PM)Mr. Bougo Wrote:
(10-24-2012, 06:52 AM)Mirio Wrote: Yeah, chain chain megas still then. ~.~

Wot.

You don't play. Tongue

wot?


RE: remaking final rage ........... - Mr. Bougo - 10-24-2012

(10-24-2012, 12:42 PM)kojn^ Wrote:
(10-24-2012, 12:39 PM)Mirio Wrote:
(10-24-2012, 12:33 PM)Mr. Bougo Wrote:
(10-24-2012, 06:52 AM)Mirio Wrote: Yeah, chain chain megas still then. ~.~

Wot.

You don't play. Tongue

wot?

Chain chain quoting still then.

Mirio told me it was duel slang.

Mirio Wrote:the problem about final rage is that you can chain the megas (3) in like 5 seconds
and .. there is still the same problem, even if you switch 1 armor into 50 armor ..
you can get the mega health and armor still quickly Tongue
The rest of the quote is irrelevant.


RE: remaking final rage ........... - hutty - 10-24-2012

i'm not going to put spikes where the lava was ....

I might just not have lava there ...

also I cant compile the map with the lava for the same reason of this http://forums.xonotic.org/showthread.php?tid=3582


RE: remaking final rage ........... - aa - 10-24-2012

Well you can use slime or goo instead of lava, dont you? Or slime doesnt work as well?


RE: remaking final rage ........... - rocknroll237 - 10-24-2012

Dude, you HAVE to add lava! The map just won't be the same. Smile


RE: remaking final rage ........... - hutty - 10-24-2012

i'll have to experiemnt (the afterslime slime is really blue lava)

but also note ... that area is completely covered in grass and leaves and such (or at lease will be )

adding lava wouldn't make sense ...

maybe a bottomless pit ...

I'm focusing more on the indor section at the moment ...


RE: remaking final rage ........... - HellYeah - 10-25-2012

Yea, I totally agree on hundread percent.


RE: remaking final rage ........... - hutty - 10-25-2012

with who?


RE: remaking final rage ........... - Maddin - 10-25-2012

Uhm, spambot... ? Troll... ?


RE: remaking final rage ........... - Justin - 10-25-2012

Don't overdo it though, try to keep the layout from orginal one (as Kojn said) and make it more organic-like. Instead of lava: add water or some sort of acid (make it look like deep water and add trigger hurt dealing small amount of damage), you can also add some realisticly looking glass.

DO NOT cover each area with grass and leaves. Don't overdo effects and greenzones, because thats not Xonotic style and that won't help gameplay and it will be a mess. You can make some nice green eye-candy stuff but be carefull about adding bigger plant models like trees. Look at Maddins Bio Labour if you want good example of proper usage of plants.

Good luck with this remake!


RE: remaking final rage ........... - hutty - 10-25-2012

The grass to indoor ratio will be about the same as soalrium ... and yes ...

There will be trees and stuff ... but mostly off stage ... poking over the top of the big middle grassy area ... (even casting animated shadows (if I can do that ... ))

I also tried out LO's layout recently ... seeing as I like it ... and havn't heard anything against it ... I am using his layout ...

I am also planning on replacing 2 of the teleporters to a reflectionless warpzone (seeing as having a tele that links right to another tele is silly (and leads to the hold-down-the-revers-key effect))


RE: remaking final rage ........... - Mr. Bougo - 10-26-2012

(10-25-2012, 06:55 PM)hutty Wrote: I am also planning on replacing 2 of the teleporters to a reflectionless warpzone (seeing as having a tele that links right to another tele is silly (and leads to the hold-down-the-revers-key effect))

I don't think replacing teleporter pairs with warpzones is always a good thing. Warpzones and teleporters are much different and you should not replace one with the other just because you can.


RE: remaking final rage ........... - hutty - 10-26-2012

thats true ... they are different ...
maybe i'll leave them be ...
I don't know ...

I need peoples opinions ....


RE: remaking final rage ........... - asyyy - 10-26-2012

Warpzones, fake grass and boxes please. Oh and reduce fps by at least 300% with useless reflections. That should make it an official Xonotic map. Bonus points for including narrow corridors, doors and elevators.


RE: remaking final rage ........... - hutty - 10-26-2012

someone doesn't like redplanet ....

on the contrary though ...I want to keep the fps at a high point ...
To do this I am avoiding reflections .. particle effects ... patchmesh terrain ... animated models ...

I already took the boxes out (noone like them ... ) Although I may add some small decorative ones at the side
....

Anyways ... Assuming that I can get all options running at a great fps ...

What looks better?

What kind of grass do you want?
2D - 3Dish (not a fur shader ... although it looks like one) ?

What kind of tiles
2D - 3D?

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