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Poll: Do you like the race game levels?
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Absolutely - love 'em.
50.00%
9 50.00%
No, don't like them.
11.11%
2 11.11%
I don't really have an opinion.
38.89%
7 38.89%
Total 18 vote(s) 100%
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[SUGGESTION] Thumbs down to the race levels

#1
Why oh why do devlopers always do dumb things like compulsory platform levels in their shooters. I mean come on - lvl 16 courtfun? I'm play FPS because I like to shoot things, if I liked nauseating precision bouncing I'd play Sonic. Another terrible take on this is the number of FPS I've seen where the hero jumps into a tank / jeep / whatever and we get "bonus" car racing game within the FPS game... so annoying. I think the devs imagine it shows their range of programming skills or something. IMO it takes more away from the game than it adds.

Yes, I am noob to Xonotic, and yes I have beaten lvl 16 courtfun. Didn't enjoy it though. Just saying.

I'm guessing my view won't be popular with fanboy gamers but what the heck - I'll poll to see how others thing; maybe you can change my mind.
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#2
courtfun is actually really bad as a race map.

also defragging is not a crime. some people like it. hopefully when 1.0 comes out we will have an actual campagin/story mode that won't force players to go fast, but still encourage them to.

Welcome to the forums!
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#3
Cheers s1lence. Might be a nano-Q but, what's "defragging" in our context?
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#4
(12-18-2012, 01:50 AM)Lancer Wrote: Cheers s1lence. Might be a nano-Q but, what's "defragging" in our context?

DeFRaG was the freeware quake III mod dedicated to trickjumping that spawned the race scene for arena shooters.
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#5
The Xonotic campaign mode is not intended to be taken seriously. This game centers around multi-player, where you can choose a server by game type, if you don't like race don't play on a race server, its a matter of preference.
<[-z-]> have you seen the documentary "happy"?
<Samual_> no
<Samual_> it sounds horrible
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#6
(12-18-2012, 03:59 AM)Liquid Sin Wrote: The Xonotic campaign mode is not intended to be taken seriously. This game centers around multi-player, where you can choose a server by game type, if you don't like race don't play on a race server, its a matter of preference.
That would be a huge shortcoming of the game. Yes, I am new to Xonotic, though I have beaten the campaign modes of a number of the classics (Quake series, Unreal & Unreal Tournaments etc). Even today connections are not always even ground (Xonotic is no exception) so for some of us the campaign is the better part of the game. Why would they have it and yet not take it seriously?
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#7
Being quick around a map is a huge part in playing a fast paced shooter like Xonotic.
"Yes, there was a spambot some time ago on these forums." - aa
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#8
The campaign is also meant to give you a tour of what's available in the game. Someone might like defrag better than minsta and be delightfully surprised to find out that there is such a game mode in Xonotic.

Also, as Pinkrobot said, precise, fast movement is a very important thing to master for any game mode in Xonotic. So it's good to get used to that!

Multiplayer is by far the most important type of play the devs focus on. There's a big lack of resources in the singleplayer department and I wouldn't view the current campaign mode as anything more than a simple solution to fill the singleplayer/offline gap. If people enjoy it, that's great, and I know some do; but if they don't they are better off ignoring it or, better, contributing to make it more solid and coherent.

As a side note, there is originally a Nexball campaign level between 13 (stormkeep TDM) and 14 (glowplant domination), you'd have hated that even more Wink
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#9
I created the campaign (Level 21 is broken btw [not my fault Tongue]) and noticed what you said, but yeah - like MrBougo and PinkRobot mentioned - the campaign is basically there to give you a short view onto the gamemodes available in Xonotic and Race CTS (Race != Race CTS actually) is a part of it, thus there is 1 level.

I know that Courtfun is not great in Race CTS but it's (/was) the only official map back then which supports this mode.

The Multiplayer is the important and fun thing. Wink
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#10
(12-18-2012, 08:48 AM)Mirio Wrote: (Level 21 is broken btw [not my fault Tongue])

LIAR! Its your fault!
<Samual> I am the most unprofessional developer ever
<bluez> halogene, you make awesome music, but you have no clue about ctf.
<Halogene> I didn't know mappers include some mysterious waypoints so members of the BOT clan can navigate a map?
<divVerent> if you don't pay for a premium account, your movement speed is limited to 100qu/s
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#11
If you don't like the levels, you can simply skip them.

Personally, I think the race levels are really good fun, but I understand that some (especially newbies) will find them really annoying at times... Tongue
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#12
(12-18-2012, 04:19 AM)PinkRobot Wrote: Being quick around a map is a huge part in playing a fast paced shooter like Xonotic.
I've beaten all single player levels (1-20 anyway; level 21 has me all alone with no one to fight) so I don't think "being quick around a map" is the issue I'm raising. I was voicing my opinion (and it is only my opinion) that the forced racer concept simply isn't fun.

I don't see any reason (aside from resources as mentioned) why Xonotoc shouldn't be a very good campaigner. It might not have the developing story-map style of Quake 1 & 2, but even Quake 3 Arena (or Unreal Tournament) provides a good example in terms of great scenarios of sensibly progressive difficulty. I think Q3 Arena went as far as to separate CTF missions from the tournament bouts so the shooting community could focus on what we like best. When I hit the Xonotic chase levels they felt like an annoyance chore blocking the next levels behind them.
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#13
Note that it's a huge step between winning over some bots and winning over real player, and if that's getting to easy there is a very active competive community at #xonotic.pickup.

EDIT: Xontic ia Free software, if you want to add a feature you can. Wink
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#14
(12-18-2012, 02:32 PM)Lancer Wrote: level 21 has me all alone with no one to fight

You can edit the file data/data/campaign.cfg in your data directory (in the Xonotic console (shift escape), type which data/campaign.cfg to find out where that is). Bump the index by one to skip that level.

I don't think we can set aside CTS from the campaign altogether just because some people don't like it. A sensible way to have everyone happy would be to provide a separate CTS campaign, but then we'd need way more official CTS maps than we could reasonably include in a release.
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#15
(12-18-2012, 04:40 PM)machine! Wrote: Note that it's a huge step between winning over some bots and winning over real player...

The number of people I've heard say that, but when I ask them it turns out they haven't actually bothered to complete all the campaigns... fails to amaze me anymore. What you'd be correct on is that real players devise clever strategies and tactics which AI often lacks. On the other hand, if your "huge step between" is in terms of difficulty, then I'll blatently point out that you're wrong. Go out and play Quake III Arena to beat Xaero on nightmare level and then tell me otherwise. The trick with setting difficulty in AI is not trying to 100% out-gun the player and make it impossible. That's easy. It's actually giving the AI bot the right amount of inaccuracy so that they only appear to be as accurate as a human ace-shot, sothe player feels they've accomplished something after their close-shave win.

Back on topic... (that was a tangent)

(12-18-2012, 05:16 PM)Mr. Bougo Wrote: You can edit the file data/data/campaign.cfg in your data directory (in the Xonotic console (shift escape), type which data/campaign.cfg to find out where that is). Bump the index by one to skip that level.

Thanks for that - I'll look into it.

Would we really have more maps than we'd know what to do with? I'd say 20 or so of the decided official best tournament, and another 20 for CTF, another section of race games (if people really are into this)would be feasable. Putting them into separate areas of game type would be something I'd support.
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#16
Can't add 50 maps to the game...

Two solutions:

1. Play online different maps with the gamemode you like.
2. Download custom maps and set up own matches vs bots in the "Create" section.
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#17
Quote:(Level 21 is broken btw [not my fault Tongue])

Not in autobuild since quite a while.
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#18
(12-18-2012, 06:04 PM)Lancer Wrote: Would we really have more maps than we'd know what to do with? I'd say 20 or so of the decided official best tournament, and another 20 for CTF, another section of race games (if people really are into this)would be feasable. Putting them into separate areas of game type would be something I'd support.

That would be too much work and it would take up too much space. Even 20 maps of any mode is a lot.
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#19
Well - make it 10 good official maps? Is this a issue (unable to make more than a few levels) unique to Xonotic?
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#20
Undecided Took the advice of tweaking the config to bypass the buggy level 21 only to find that level 22 stormkeep is yet another sucky Mario jumpy race thing, complete with hilarious lava traps.

http://www.openarena.ws/download.php?list.61 => downloading.
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#21
That seems like the best choice for everyboy, have fun!

Thread closed and marked as solved.
"Yes, there was a spambot some time ago on these forums." - aa
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#22
Lancer felt that the closing of this thread was not legitimate, so I'll open it again.

Go ahead Lancer, explain how dismissive the arguments above were to your opinion, and how passive aggression and blackmail are the correct response to this.

More seriously though, I'm waiting for constructive criticism from your part because you seem very passionate about this issue. Keep in mind that we have to show the different game modes to the new user because, believe it or not, some people like things that Lancer hates better than other things that Lancer likes.
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#23
If you don't like it Lancer, then please leave becuase your critism is just trolling not constructive!
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#24
Eh.
"Yes, there was a spambot some time ago on these forums." - aa
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#25
i like race...

is that glass half full trolling?

race sure taught me alot about movement!


t

:^
[Image: 227.png]
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