Xonotic mmo-rpg (idea for a sister project)

No, this isn't a joke nor am I on drugs or drunk... as crazy as this idea may sound I've been around other games in parallel with Xonotic, and tried some MMO's recently (that I even got a little addicted to). Tonight the idea suddenly hit me: What if Xonotic could have a sister project called Xonotic MMO? That would be exactly like the Xonotic we have now (using the same media and everything), but instead of playing matches on maps, it would be like the everyday MMO game (World Of Warcraft is the best example that can come to mind).

I know this would be very hard to do, and an insane idea that may likely never happen. But the idea felt too good not to suggest and discuss here. I know the current Xonotic doesn't even have a beta yet, so this is likely an idea for the future if anything. But if Xonotic devs would ever consider a Xonotic mmo, I would be very willing to help with working on such a project (I already have my own Nexuiz-forked game). Anyway, here is my idea of an Xonotic MMO as I see it:

It would of course be the same Xonotic as now, and start as a fork from the current Xonotic. But instead of having a Player Setup menu, you only have your Settings and Server List menus. You choose a server you permanently wish to join (using the same server system of course) and are asked to register an account on it or log in (otherwise characters can't be stored). Once you do, you create a character like on any MMO game. The character models would of course be the same, only that you choose a name and model / skin permanently (as you create a character you can't edit afterward).

Once in-world, you would find yourself at the starting point that players spawn in. You would come across NPCs that give you quests, item shops, and of course monsters. Using the same weapons, you would roam around and attack monsters, challenge other players to a PvP fight (unable to shoot them otherwise) or find any activity you'd like. Players would level up and get skill points as they do this, that they can spend on increasing the power of their weapons, their resistance, etc. And of course, there doesn't need to be only one world in the game. People could still use netRadiant to create new worlds, with new NPCs, monsters placed here and there, and all else (and make their own server with it, since the map system is of course the same). That would be the basic idea of it all... the rest would be distant future details when this would be really considered.

On the technical side: Part of this wouldn't be too difficult imo. A leveling and skilling system would be very easy to make (I think I could implement that myself). A skills window should also be easy, where you can choose to upgrade your health, armor, or even individual weapons. Monsters already exist in the current Xonotic (eg. the walker and wheelie). The wheelee could be the first level 1 monster of the main world for example.

There would of course be issues. Like how DP can performantly handle *huge* outdoor maps, and save characters and their settings (not sure if the current savegame system could work for something so complex). And of course who will ever do something so hard, and be willing to take Xonotic in such a new direction. But if ways can be found around these issues, I believe it's totally possible.

Like I said, I'd be more than willing to work on such a project in parallel with the tournament-type Xonotic (that of course should never be affected). But I don't think this is something I could adventure in on my own. So I'd currently like to know how many people would be interested in such a sister project, and of course what Xonotic devs would be willing to work on this sometime. Also, would such an idea harm the normal Xonotic if it happened? We' be maintaining two Xonotics together (one like UT and another like WoW ).

If such a game would be made, I'm certain it would be a beautiful one, that would be very loved and addictive soon. The internet needs a free sci-fi MMO too! So yeah, I'd like to hear thoughts and opinions on this. And who knows... maybe it might actually happen someday

Cool idea, I'd help if I had the time. More good open source MMOs are needed

Had a chat about this on IRC. There is indeed a real problem, that I'm not sure how can be fixed: DP's performance on large maps. Even medium sized outdoor maps are said to have performance issues... let alone a whole world that would probably go off netRadiant's boundaries. Even if vis is good the map would still take days to compile at such a size. And multiple maps aren't possible either, since a server can't run multiple maps for individual players (so you can load a different map for someone who goes in a certain area). Also no chance of a day / night cycle with Darkplaces.

Still, I would like to hope a workaround can be found. Once again, this certainly wouldn't be something for the near future... but maybe someday And totally agreed on more opensource MMO's being needed. Only found one so far (which is very good) but more would certainly be lovely.

theres a larger problem then dp's render performance. how to finance enough server and network capability.

I would support this idea, and potentially help with development in any way that I can. An easier solution would be an advanced LOD system like guildwars or oblivion. They replace objects with 2d alpha texture versions at a great enough distance. We could also make use of a good minimap and quest tracker. Don't forget to simply add a max view distance with some sort of fog to smooth it out.


Also, you could take the Gunz and Phantasy Star Online route. Make multiple lobbies for different regions and a system to party up and join specific maps and quests. For a better idea of this, google "PSOBB private server", it's the only remaining online PC version of the game, and it's free(legal). The game could make use of enclosed levels for parties of up to 6 players, with enemies ranging from tiny goons and mini bosses, to big bad giant bosses. Don't forget about items and inventory (=. Equipment should play a major role.

there is a rpg mod for doom 3, which used mostly dungeons
http://www.moddb.com/mods/dungeondoom

its also a good example of a simple inventory

That would be a good idea. I played Gunz Online (long ago though, the auto-download system stopped working last time I tried it). That would be an easier and possibly more likely path. Would still require a lobby though, an item shop and all that. I'd still wish for a massive world though...

Like Sauer RPG? Make a big, I mean, A VERY BIG MAP, and make the default map, can't be changed, item shop in there, bla bla bla, etc., etc..

Nah, maybe like Dynasty Warriors Online?

No, this isn't a joke nor am I on drugs or drunk... as crazy as this idea may sound I've been around other games in parallel with Xonotic, and tried some MMO's recently (that I even got a little addicted to). Tonight the idea suddenly hit me: What if Xonotic could have a sister project called Xonotic MMO? That would be exactly like the Xonotic we have now (using the same media and everything), but instead of playing matches on maps, it would be like the everyday MMO game (World Of Warcraft is the best example that can come to mind).

I know this would be very hard to do, and an insane idea that may likely never happen. But the idea felt too good not to suggest and discuss here. I know the current Xonotic doesn't even have a beta yet, so this is likely an idea for the future if anything. But if Xonotic devs would ever consider a Xonotic mmo, I would be very willing to help with working on such a project (I already have my own Nexuiz-forked game). Anyway, here is my idea of an Xonotic MMO as I see it:

It would of course be the same Xonotic as now, and start as a fork from the current Xonotic. But instead of having a Player Setup menu, you only have your Settings and Server List menus. You choose a server you permanently wish to join (using the same server system of course) and are asked to register an account on it or log in (otherwise characters can't be stored). Once you do, you create a character like on any MMO game. The character models would of course be the same, only that you choose a name and model / skin permanently (as you create a character you can't edit afterward).

Once in-world, you would find yourself at the starting point that players spawn in. You would come across NPCs that give you quests, item shops, and of course monsters. Using the same weapons, you would roam around and attack monsters, challenge other players to a PvP fight (unable to shoot them otherwise) or find any activity you'd like. Players would level up and get skill points as they do this, that they can spend on increasing the power of their weapons, their resistance, etc. And of course, there doesn't need to be only one world in the game. People could still use netRadiant to create new worlds, with new NPCs, monsters placed here and there, and all else (and make their own server with it, since the map system is of course the same). That would be the basic idea of it all... the rest would be distant future details when this would be really considered.

On the technical side: Part of this wouldn't be too difficult imo. A leveling and skilling system would be very easy to make (I think I could implement that myself). A skills window should also be easy, where you can choose to upgrade your health, armor, or even individual weapons. Monsters already exist in the current Xonotic (eg. the walker and wheelie). The wheelee could be the first level 1 monster of the main world for example.

There would of course be issues. Like how DP can performantly handle *huge* outdoor maps, and save characters and their settings (not sure if the current savegame system could work for something so complex). And of course who will ever do something so hard, and be willing to take Xonotic in such a new direction. But if ways can be found around these issues, I believe it's totally possible.

Like I said, I'd be more than willing to work on such a project in parallel with the tournament-type Xonotic (that of course should never be affected). But I don't think this is something I could adventure in on my own. So I'd currently like to know how many people would be interested in such a sister project, and of course what Xonotic devs would be willing to work on this sometime. Also, would such an idea harm the normal Xonotic if it happened? We' be maintaining two Xonotics together (one like UT and another like WoW ).

If such a game would be made, I'm certain it would be a beautiful one, that would be very loved and addictive soon. The internet needs a free sci-fi MMO too! So yeah, I'd like to hear thoughts and opinions on this. And who knows... maybe it might actually happen someday

YYYYAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!! i've been waiting for You to post this!
i've never been a big fan of MMO's, but diversion is fun, and seeing what You've done with this game in VT made me realise that the reason i dislike most MMO/RPG's is that they lack the flexibility of this game and community (not to mention the theme).
i believe this is exactly the reason why this game is superior to even commercial ones.

There's several ways as i see it:
* Stick and work within the limits of DP,
* Switch the engine,
* Wait for a DP breakthrough (i'm sure somebody from this community will manage, sooner or later )