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Replacing spawn weapons

#43
WARNING: HUGE WALL OF TEXT COMING FROM ME AGAIN. You asked for feedback, you got it.
Samual, you'd be a very good politician, because I countered your ideas with detailed descriptions of problems, yet you:

-reply in a brief, mish-mashy way, without actual reasoning, proofs, ideas (not just for me, for MrBougo too)
-in the end, when I say, removing the trouting would hard the fun factor for (imho) many of us, you simply reply with:

"Thirdly, yes trouting will be removed because there's no other way to do it. Get over it Tongue"

I fucking don't like it this way. You seemingly asked for feedback, but in the end, it seems you don't really want to hear nor consider any of them. You just say "trust me, I thought this well out, I'm good at this". You don't seem to contemplate all the reasons people brought up here, and in the end only one will remains: yours. Like a good politician.

But let me reply in the democratic way (haha) again:

The idea of configuring how the primary or secondary WOULD be good, if it won't bring any more confusion to the configuration of the game. For me, it woulnd't be, but remember how people were raging all around, that there are just too many options to change or choose from in the menu? You just made things simplier, and now you'd like to add even more? Before you counter it, that if it won't be in the menu, than it'd be configurable with a cvar... well, good luck putting that in the mainstream mind, nobody would know about it, and hence nobody would use it. Also, changing primary to secondary is already doable right now too, with aliases.

Charging for melee:
"I don't even like the idea of charging anyway precisely, i'll just have to figure out some way to handle the melee and jumping at the same time."

Oh, I thought you've had all cleared in your mind before you started this. Tongue But ok, back on topic, and no more mockery.

I raised my concerns in my points:
2/laserjumping charged: you said laserjuming ability won't be charged. That was a misunderstanding from me, fine. I'm good on that one. LASERJUMPING WON'T BE CHARGED, right?
2/charging melee: I quote you: "I don't even like the idea of charging anyway precisely". We're good on this again, moving on...
3/fast backswitching. Ok, fine, I can forfeit on this. It really doesn't do anything on the laser secondary, the switching back on current laser secondary is truly a lack of imagination from the dev team. Also, like Antibody said, it's only "muscle memory" on that. One can switch back anytime with proper weapon binds.
4/trouting...
So, you want to remove a funny, geeky feature, that tells Xonotic apart from the many other FPS games, and that some people including myself have already fond memories of.
Let me tell you the reasons why I like trouting, while I think it should stay, and why I'd hate it being gone away:
Xonotic, while tries to be mainstream too, was developed mainly by geeks for geeks. For those who still don't know, trouting or shotgun slapping is a reference to mIRC, an IRC client, where the

Code:
/slap xy

command will tell "me slapped xy with a large trout" or something similar. I know you Samual know this, and many others too on the forum here. Still, this is called an "insider joke", and when 0.6 was released, I talked a lot with new players on the servers. When I asked them about the fish, they were either clueless, but still curious, or the others, who got the reference, and said it was hilarious, and liked it very much.
Fish are generally funny, don't remove the fish.
By removing trouting, you'll remove double trouting too. And that's funny again as hell, I remember I truly started laughing out loud when I first saw it.
By removing the trouting, you'll remove a key element from the game now many for us, and a good memory too: the First, Melee tournament. It might be only me who's too sentimental on this issue, but it's still a good thing to remember, and another thing that ties me to this community, and I'd hate you if you'd cut this wire.

You want to literally squeeze 3 different functions into only ONE gun. This is just freaking too much, face it, with your words, get over it.
You can merge shotgun primary into laser. You can remove ammo for it, especially if it gets a new effect. This is fine.
The main problem lies in implementing the other two features into the same gun. Laserjumping should be on a different gun, because laserjumping allows you large freedom in movement. You can gain speed, height, maybe even dodge with it. If you'd place this feature along a "powerful" primary firemode, it'll be too easy. Like in Minstagib or OverKill, but in those gamemodes it is fine, those are based on hecticness anyway. The movement freedom coming from laserjumping MUST be penalised somehow, and it already is: you have to switch a gun for that. Though if with playtests this comes out to not to be a problem, I might be fine with it.
But again, what about the melee? I stated a lot of stuff about it already, and honestly, I can't accept FruitieX's standpoint, about mouses in general having more than 3 buttons+scrollwheel. NO THEY DON'T. For a casual gamer or computer user, no. And Xonotic has to be fun for them too, you can't tell in the system requirements "needs mouse with more than 3 buttons". You can say, bind it to the keyboard then, but this can be frustrating and a no go for a lot of people (like me too, even though I have a mouse with 5 buttons, but I still haven't lost empathy to others...)
You're also totally wrong on the issue "I can use the same laser model". Just look at the barrel of that gun, it's a small stuff, how the hell do you think a gun with a tight barrel like this would spit out particles in a wide way, like shotgun pellets? It doesn't make any sence.

Like I said above, I can't see any problems with the current spawn weapons. Maybe the laser could have a better, good secondary firemode.
[Image: 561.png]
"One should strive to achieve; not sit in bitter regret."
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Messages In This Thread
Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-19-2012, 03:24 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 05-19-2012, 03:28 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Cortez666 - 05-19-2012, 03:30 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-19-2012, 03:45 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mepper - 05-19-2012, 03:32 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-19-2012, 03:50 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 05-19-2012, 03:38 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mr. Bougo - 05-19-2012, 04:02 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-19-2012, 04:05 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-19-2012, 04:09 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Cortez666 - 05-19-2012, 04:20 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-19-2012, 05:03 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-19-2012, 05:52 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-19-2012, 04:24 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mr. Bougo - 05-19-2012, 04:34 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-19-2012, 04:55 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-19-2012, 04:40 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Chryyz - 05-19-2012, 04:55 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-19-2012, 04:55 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by _Subzero_ - 05-19-2012, 05:09 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by srkdy - 05-19-2012, 05:14 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by _Subzero_ - 05-19-2012, 05:28 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-19-2012, 06:09 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by kojn^ - 05-19-2012, 06:28 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-19-2012, 06:59 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-19-2012, 07:20 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by kojn^ - 05-19-2012, 08:14 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-20-2012, 05:35 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Antibody - 05-19-2012, 06:58 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by _Subzero_ - 05-19-2012, 08:34 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by kojn^ - 05-19-2012, 08:37 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by 0siris - 05-19-2012, 10:10 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-19-2012, 10:11 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-20-2012, 06:12 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-19-2012, 10:36 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-20-2012, 12:24 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-20-2012, 05:36 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-20-2012, 05:57 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 02:33 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 05-20-2012, 03:35 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mr. Bougo - 05-20-2012, 03:43 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 03:47 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 05-20-2012, 09:20 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mepper - 05-20-2012, 04:11 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by freefang - 05-20-2012, 04:22 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Cortez666 - 05-20-2012, 04:33 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 05-20-2012, 04:43 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-20-2012, 05:09 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by _Subzero_ - 05-20-2012, 05:50 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-20-2012, 07:10 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-20-2012, 09:46 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 05-20-2012, 05:13 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-20-2012, 05:24 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 06:06 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 06:28 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Justin - 05-20-2012, 06:48 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 07:03 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by kuniu the frogg - 05-20-2012, 07:10 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 07:41 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-20-2012, 08:00 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 08:10 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-20-2012, 12:07 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-20-2012, 12:16 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-20-2012, 12:23 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 12:18 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mr. Bougo - 05-20-2012, 12:43 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-20-2012, 01:09 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-20-2012, 12:44 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by nowego4 - 05-20-2012, 12:59 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-20-2012, 01:11 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-20-2012, 01:20 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mr. Bougo - 05-20-2012, 04:34 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 05-20-2012, 02:13 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-20-2012, 02:35 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by poVoq - 05-20-2012, 03:24 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-20-2012, 04:18 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by 0siris - 05-20-2012, 07:02 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-20-2012, 07:29 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by nowego4 - 05-21-2012, 12:11 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Chryyz - 05-21-2012, 12:59 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 05-21-2012, 02:19 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-21-2012, 02:44 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Chryyz - 05-21-2012, 02:57 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-21-2012, 03:17 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-21-2012, 04:27 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-21-2012, 04:48 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 05-21-2012, 05:10 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-21-2012, 05:46 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by FruitieX - 05-21-2012, 06:56 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 05-21-2012, 05:11 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 05-21-2012, 07:22 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Sless - 05-21-2012, 08:41 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 05-21-2012, 08:44 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 05-21-2012, 07:37 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by hutty - 05-21-2012, 09:20 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by _Subzero_ - 05-21-2012, 09:56 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 05-21-2012, 10:40 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by hutty - 05-21-2012, 11:47 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Debugger - 05-21-2012, 01:16 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by tZork - 05-21-2012, 01:18 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 05-21-2012, 01:37 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-21-2012, 01:53 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 05-21-2012, 01:57 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mepper - 05-21-2012, 02:08 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rocknroll237 - 05-27-2012, 03:03 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 05-28-2012, 03:35 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Archer - 05-29-2012, 10:44 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by killgenerals - 06-05-2012, 12:06 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Archer - 06-05-2012, 12:43 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 06-05-2012, 02:04 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by tZork - 06-05-2012, 04:41 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Cortez666 - 06-05-2012, 04:51 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Samual - 06-05-2012, 04:55 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Cortez666 - 06-05-2012, 05:04 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by tZork - 06-05-2012, 05:04 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 06-05-2012, 05:48 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rocknroll237 - 06-05-2012, 05:53 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 06-05-2012, 11:19 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by hutty - 06-06-2012, 12:31 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 06-06-2012, 03:50 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by noteven - 06-24-2012, 05:14 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by W4RP1G - 06-25-2012, 08:04 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by CuBe0wL - 06-25-2012, 10:38 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 06-06-2012, 02:40 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Halogene - 06-25-2012, 03:23 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by frostwyrm333 - 06-06-2012, 03:08 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 06-25-2012, 04:10 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Mepper - 06-25-2012, 05:57 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by K__ - 06-25-2012, 09:57 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Lee_Stricklin - 06-25-2012, 10:46 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 06-25-2012, 10:52 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by K__ - 06-25-2012, 10:54 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by Lee_Stricklin - 06-25-2012, 10:58 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by K__ - 06-25-2012, 11:50 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by K__ - 06-26-2012, 07:02 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by K__ - 07-01-2012, 05:26 PM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rocknroll237 - 07-02-2012, 05:48 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by K__ - 07-02-2012, 06:07 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by rafallus - 07-02-2012, 08:11 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by machine! - 07-07-2012, 04:28 AM
RE: Replacing spawn weapons - by asyyy - 07-07-2012, 04:57 AM

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