bot AI and balance/physics configs

While I'm trying to keep the balance crap from bleeding out onto the forum as much as possible, I have discovered something that that is worth looking at. I found out that under different movement and balance sets that the bots have varying degree of playability ranging from laughable to acceptable and even excellent. I've noticed while tweaking that bots aren't the best at bunnyhopping under the defaults, but they still do them on occasion. Under my config which mixes ground combat, bunnyhopping, and aerial craziness they seem to have no problem getting around the arena (due to the focus not being on speed maintaining but on mixed movements and adjusting for a situation) and actually putting up a fight in a deathmatch when their difficulty level is increased. They also seem to be somewhat efficient with the weapons, outside of some obvious things like them not laser boosting and using combos (the ones they do pull are from situation changes mostly from getting close to an opponent after firing shots with a different weapon) frequently. Just thought that was something interesting to point out since a balance/physics config that works well with the bots would mean players could get more practice before going online and getting owned. I've yet to test this under other configs outside of the defaults and my own so I don't know how Samual's balance would work with the bots yet.

Sounds like good work, Lee.

One other thing we need to do is teach the bots to unfreeze team mates in freezetag. If you play locally right now and get frozen, you could sit there the whole time limit and not see a team mate bot.

Sounds like good work, Lee.

One other thing we need to do is teach the bots to unfreeze team mates in freezetag. If you play locally right now and get frozen, you could sit there the whole time limit and not see a team mate bot.

When FruitieX coded freezetag he didn't add bot roles for it, so the bots don't know anything about how to play the game.

In addition to AI tweaks, it may be a good idea to try to make balance/physics configs that bots can handle that way offline practice is actually enjoyable. The AI actually isn't as bad as I thought it was, while it had it's quirks here and there I actually got an enjoyable CTF game on Space Elevator under my config. Just something to look at when creating balance/physics configs as you can use the opportunity to hide a few things.

Actually the bots do some kind of combo: if you get close to them they switch to Shotgun and try to slap you.

In addition to AI tweaks, it may be a good idea to try to make balance/physics configs ...

Not going to happen, because it means one of two bad things: Either adjust the settings so that it fits bots, affecting real players too. Or have a separate set for bots, in witch case they are monsters and no longer bots (as they arent under the same rules as player anymore).

Its quite likely that the bot system will be replaced with something configure and maintainable at some point, but given the games main focus if on online play its low prio compared to other issues at the moment.

are you seriously suggesting to change the physics to fit the bots needs? dont you think it should be the other way round, making good physics and then tell the bots how to deal with it?

I'm not suggesting that the physics/balance are built around the bots (this is a multiplayer game), however I am saying that it wouldn't be a bad idea to get one that works alright with them. I was mostly pointing out how the balance/physics can effect the bots because I found that interesting.

If you can isolate the cvars that give major improvements and post the good/bad values we can proly do it the right way instead, and fix the bots.

Wouldn't know exactly what cvars, but making running about as important as bunny hopping (reserving bunny hops mostly for traveling distances) did quite a bit for the bot movement in combat.