[SUGGESTION] Important: Fire from crosshair

Thanks for backing me up guys For the record, I never gave my opinion on mines, and indeed never said I would boycott Xonotic. And let it be clear I don't demand anything from the developers and I realise they are the ones that do the work (and I look forward to contributing myself when I have the programming/mapping experience to do so)

Anyway, yes, back on topic!

I find the occasional blocked shot thing mildly annoying, but not enough to change. Besides, it adds strategy to the game.

I know what you mean, but I don't agree that a limitation like this lends much strategy to the game, it's just an unnecessary quirk you have to work around as you play, it doesn't serve any purpose of itself aside from looking realistic, and perhaps allowing the player to shoot from behind certain corners (and that's a lame feature IMO). If unnecessary gameplay quirks add strategy to the game, one could deliberately make a frustrating change to any game and call the game strategic If you know what I mean

Fixed poll. Please refrain from making biased polls.

Aw, it was just a joke
Edit: Actually, can you change the first option to say "Fix issues with g_shootfromeye 1 and default" or something?

Voted "g_shootfromeye 1 default", but only if the weapon is not centered like it's 1996 all over again. As I wrote before, this can be achieved with cl_gunalign, but then projectiles and muzzle flashes are not drawn correctly. So that must be fixed first.

Yup, precisely what you said

Voted yes. I would definitely like shootfromeye to be default. But yeah, I understand that it looks ugly and probably shouldnt be default for now. If the muzzle flash wasn't fixed to shotorigin but fixed to weapon model instead (unless I misunderstood what I was told), that would fix most of the ugliness I think.

shootfromeye might not be "realistic", but neither is the game, it's definitely "arcade" so if it the ugly part was fixed, I don't see why not have it default since it's more fun and more precise. You aim with crosshair, not with weapon model, so rockets exploding to your face when aiming down a ledge while your crosshair clearly shows plenty of space around it, that never seemed right to me.

the way I understood cl_gunalign, it was a pseudo-client side setting. This means, that e.g. when the server used cl_shootfromeye, but a player had cl_gunalign set to a value that indicated he wanted the weapon to be drawn on the right side, what really happened was that also the shot came from the right side (NOT from eye).

I don't know whether this changed between 2.5.2 and xonotic development branch, but in 2.5.2 this was done this way by divverent in order to keep the WYSIWYG factor alive. WYSIWYG was also the reason why weapons are centered for g_shootfromeye. Even though this doesn't represent it exactly (to represent it exactly, weapons would have to be on eye's height, but then you'd not see anything anymore ), it represents it somewhat closely...

Personally I never mind about the weapon position any longer, since centered weapon take away less space on your screen than the weapons being shown on the right side.

the way I understood cl_gunalign, it was a pseudo-client side setting. This means, that e.g. when the server used cl_shootfromeye, but a player had cl_gunalign set to a value that indicated he wanted the weapon to be drawn on the right side, what really happened was that also the shot came from the right side (NOT from eye).

Are you sure about that? I always use cl_gunalign 1 with shootfromeye and the shot still definitely comes from eye. AFIAK, it's not possible to do anything about it clientside, shotorigin is set to whatever the server is set to, client only moves the weapon model without affecting the actual shotorigin. It was made that way so it couldn't be abused. That is easy to test, for example with nex, stand still and fire. Without shootfromeye, the beam will come from tip of gun, enable shootfromeye and the beam will be pefectly centered in the screen, no matter what you have cl_gunalign to.

Okay, maybe I was wrong about that (although I am pretty sure I am not, but I cannot prove it otherwise, hehe, I don't have Nexuiz installed here). I assume that you are talking about 2.5.2 though, right?

Yeah, 2.5.2. Have not tested in Xonotic but I assume it hasn't changed.

http://pics.nexuizninjaz.com/images/4z9f...3au890.jpg

Let's say this:

1. The VISIBLE projectile has to come out of the gun, or it looks all wrong. A minimum distance does not fix that. Just think about e.g. beams getting turned into a single dot in the center of the screen. What the hell is with that.
2. Some games then "cheated" and displayed a projectile that has nothing to do with what actually happens in the game. In fact, the visible rocket could fly through a player, or it could seem to run past a player and then detonate. So I clearly want that VISIBLE = ACTUAL projectile, as making these two not equal impairs dodging and seriously looks like bugs of the game (e.g. when a visible rocket or a beam passes through a wall).
==> the actual projectile has to come out of the gun too.
3. I would like from-eye shooting, IF IT COULD ACTUALLY BE DONE IN A WORKING AND NON-INSANE WAY. Problem is, it can't be done. Either beams become dots, or beams can go through walls. Both suck.

+1 to divverent. the visible projectile has to come out of the gun, and what happens should be exactly what you can see. so the actual projectile has to come out of the gun.

I can imagine, e.g., a QuakeLive/Warsow player thinking: "It really sucks that my shots are not blocked when my crosshair has a clear shot but there's a wall in front of my weapon model. Also, the projectiles/beams going through walls in these occasions is totally unrealistic."











No, I can't.

I don't understand why some people want stuff coming out of their forehead. That's just nasty or at least disturbing at so many levels. I haven't done stuff like that for years and the hell im starting now.

How about fire from crosshair only when something is obstructing the path?
Most of the time it would fire from weapon, and only change when its needed for the sake of gameplay.

Yeah, 2.5.2. Have not tested in Xonotic but I assume it hasn't changed.

http://pics.nexuizninjaz.com/images/4z9f...3au890.jpg

So I assume what you did is having cl_gunalign set to 1 before connecting (you probably have it set to that value anyway) and then did one shot (left image) where the server still had g_shootfromeye 0 and then you voted for g_shootfromeye 1 and fired again?

Did you also try to switch to another weapon and then back to the RL right after you voted for g_shootfromeye 1 ?

Did you also try to switch to another weapon and then back to the RL right after you voted for g_shootfromeye 1 ?

... Of course I did, I know how it behaves, I just kept the message in the screenshot to show that shootfromeye was changed, I didn't just press fire, set g_shootfromeye 1 then fire again

I don't understand why you assume I don't know what I'm doing/talking about or why we're even arguing about this

I don't understand why you assume I don't know what I'm doing/talking about or why we're even arguing about this

I'm sorry, neither do I. It's just that I clearly rememberred that when I tried that feature once, I noticed shots coming from the weapon again, as in, from the right side. And I kept thinking: how can sane persons want to see less on their screen (because of the weapon being on the right side) and at the same time shoot projectiles into corners/walls accidentally... However, it doesn't matter anyway

Let's say this:

1. The VISIBLE projectile has to come out of the gun, or it looks all wrong. A minimum distance does not fix that. Just think about e.g. beams getting turned into a single dot in the center of the screen. What the hell is with that.

Quake III solved this by drawing beams from the gun tip to the hit point, whether the beam was obstructed or not. It didn't look that bad. Meanwhile, projectiles were drawn correctly. This didn't look bad either. I've played games/servermods where railgun beams are drawn from the crosshair (ie a dot unless you move while firing) and this didn't look bad either, to be honest.

2. Some games then "cheated" and displayed a projectile that has nothing to do with what actually happens in the game. In fact, the visible rocket could fly through a player, or it could seem to run past a player and then detonate. So I clearly want that VISIBLE = ACTUAL projectile, as making these two not equal impairs dodging and seriously looks like bugs of the game (e.g. when a visible rocket or a beam passes through a wall).
==> the actual projectile has to come out of the gun too.

I absolutely agree that projectiles have to go the same path as the visible counterpart. It's not as important for hitscan weapons, because it's impossible to dodge those anyway, but for the sake of consistency, it's probably a good idea to draw hitscan beams from the crosshair as well.

3. I would like from-eye shooting, IF IT COULD ACTUALLY BE DONE IN A WORKING AND NON-INSANE WAY. Problem is, it can't be done. Either beams become dots, or beams can go through walls. Both suck.

I'm not nit picky I'm perfectly happy with hitscan beams being drawn from the gun tip, even though it means the beam will go through walls. Same goes for dot-rails drawn from the crosshair. I think you'll find players won't care all that much about how it looks, if it plays well. You're inventing a problem where there isn't one.