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Poll: Is VR something for Xonotic?
This poll is closed.
I would love it!
65.52%
19 65.52%
No thnx.
34.48%
10 34.48%
Total 29 vote(s) 100%
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[SUGGESTION] Oculus VR Rift support

#1
Question 
Is there any chance there comes build in support for the Oculus Rift? Would love to see it in linux/Ubuntu!

For the testing part i am glad to help out. Programming is a little to mutch i am afraid. Never gone further as some basic Java.
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#2
Hey, welcome to the forums. Could you please provide some information what you suggesting is? Wikipedia says it is some kind of head-mounted display, didn't read it carefully though.

Just a side note, a suggestion is just the first step getting something in the game, before even considering making a poll you should have discussed it with the community and best of all found a developer or contributor who is considering helping out implement it if you can't yourself.
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#3
Thnx for the welcome!

The best place to start is i think the devellopers website itself. http://www.oculusvr.com/blog/ and subscribe for the newsletter.

They are now about to ship the first development kits for the gaming industry. In about a month from now they release the SDK. They will support game devellopment where they can is promised. In 2014 they plan to release a consumer version of the Rift with a better display and a other upgrades. What i mostly hear about this thing is that it is actually the first time VR is done right and already quite immersive. I could not wait for another year so ordered one already (i love VR) so in that sence i can help with the testing part it. For the devellopers is it maybe worth the investment. A develloper kit comes for $300,- and must be already quite good if you can beliefe the reviews. And there are quite a lot.
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#4
Is this compatible with open-source and our license?

Oculus support would give a considerable advantage over other arena shooters, and would definitely bring more players, even if half of them will join only to check out Oculus.
I'm ready to donate some moneys for the developer kit. I'm pretty sure Carmack will implement Oculus for Quake Live, so maybe if we will be faster, we'll own Carmack at his own game, ha-ha.
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#5
I doubt any dev here is interested by this. People are welcome to try though, but I wouldn't expect anything in the near future.

Maybe you can contact this person called Joel Clemens, who implemented a sort of VR in DarkPlaces (the engine Xonotic uses) five years ago. He might have documents to share, who knows. But I'm not sure who will be willing to deal with the expensive devkit. It's probably better to wait until there is concurrence and the system becomes affordable and proves to not be just a temporary gimmick anyway.

Links:
EDIT: Harmata is right, if a dev is interested, they should first look into the specifics of licensing too. Especially if the product is not released yet, they might be keeping the interface under locks.
[Image:http://i.imgur.com/4XODR.png]640K ought to be enough for anybody.
     ― Linux Torvalds
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#6
As far as i understand it, is that itᷰs aiming at first into integration with Windows PC and Android. Nothing about open source and GPL and no mean to ask at the moment. But Adroid is some kind of open source already. Since there look mostly at the hardware side of it there are good chances there is support fore open source.

Unreal and Unity will be integrated out of the box. Carmack already has the first game with full integration. Doom 3.

FPS are by far the easiest platforms to integrate the headset however and a good place to start. Cockpits forexample in flightsimulators or mech games are mutch more complex. If there is a place to start in linux for VR this is the place.

(02-11-2013, 01:28 PM)Mr. Bougo Wrote: I doubt any dev here is interested by this. People are welcome to try though, but I wouldn't expect anything in the near future.

Maybe you can contact this person called Joel Clemens, who implemented a sort of VR in DarkPlaces (the engine Xonotic uses) five years ago. He might have documents to share, who knows. But I'm not sure who will be willing to deal with the expensive devkit. It's probably better to wait until there is concurrence and the system becomes affordable and proves to not be just a temporary gimmick anyway.

Links:
EDIT: Harmata is right, if a dev is interested, they should first look into the specifics of licensing too. Especially if the product is not released yet, they might be keeping the interface under locks.

Thanks for the links. It is a little bit early to start with this all. I recieve my headset in about a month from now, maybe later. They promised that the interface would be fully open in a two layer fashion. From sensor data for the devellopers who wants to start from raw data, to a layer with sensorfusion as they call it, where you can use the SDK to do the calculations and corrections for you. Same with the field of view and the fishboilcorrection.

Competition is alway s a good thing. Only would like to see linux keeping up with windows in gaming. But as they have promised for the Ubuntu platform, this will be the year, so i can finally place Windows by garbadge Smile yes!
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#7
Quote:Carmack already has the first game with full integration. Doom 3.
Aw maaan, there goes my dream to pwn him.
He pwned himself already with Rage tho.
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#8
(02-11-2013, 03:34 PM)Harmata Wrote:
Quote:Carmack already has the first game with full integration. Doom 3.
Aw maaan, there goes my dream to pwn him.
He pwned himself already with Rage tho.

If you like Carmack, here are some nice youtube s where he is going into VR... As i understand the stories, he did the complete buildin Oculus Rift support in one day. ( But yah, therefore he is John Carmack Big Grin )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyuMVazQPos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kw-DlWwlX...ata_player
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#9
High framerates +Defrag + Occulus = hellish motion sickness.
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#10
Hi, guys! I have DevKit of Oculus Rift)) Xonotic - is my most favorite game and I would like to see it with Oculus. Do we have any progress with VR support?
I found r_stereo_vertical, r_stereo_separation, viewsize and "Field of View" settings, but no luck - picture is really bad...
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#11
(07-25-2013, 12:30 PM)Rabit Wrote: Hi, guys! I have DevKit of Oculus Rift)) Xonotic - is my most favorite game and I would like to see it with Oculus. Do we have any progress with VR support?
I found r_stereo_vertical, r_stereo_separation, viewsize and "Field of View" settings, but no luck - picture is really bad...

I'm not sure why you expect any progress without access to developers and devkits. You're the first person I see who has a dev kit.

r_stereo_* is for a couple of traditional approaches to stereography (anaglyph, cross-eyed / parallel viewing). I'm not sure that device of yours is meant to work with that.
[Image:http://i.imgur.com/4XODR.png]640K ought to be enough for anybody.
     ― Linux Torvalds
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#12
(07-25-2013, 01:10 PM)Mr. Bougo Wrote: I'm not sure why you expect any progress without access to developers and devkits. You're the first person I see who has a dev kit.

r_stereo_* is for a couple of traditional approaches to stereography (anaglyph, cross-eyed / parallel viewing). I'm not sure that device of yours is meant to work with that.

So, this is great base for VR googles - we only need distortion filter and some parameters (like eyes distance)...
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#13
I wish it were that simple. We still don't have a willing developer with access to a dev kit.
[Image:http://i.imgur.com/4XODR.png]640K ought to be enough for anybody.
     ― Linux Torvalds
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#14
(07-25-2013, 05:47 PM)Mr. Bougo Wrote: I wish it were that simple. We still don't have a willing developer with access to a dev kit.
Yeah, developing w/o devkit is uncomfortably and I can help only with testing & debugging - because xonotic source is really hard for me((
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#15
Just got my DevKit as well, unfortunately not in a position to help add support to Xonotic (not a developer, just a VR enthusiast).

I was searching to see if anyone had success tweaking the r_stereo_ settings to make it viewable on the Rift.

It seems that with the settings already implemented which provide SBS viewing, all that would be required is the distortion layer and IPD (interpupillary distance) tweaks as Rabit mentioned. I'm not sure on how the licensing works with the SDK, but the HMD is just treated as an external monitor and from what I have read from developers basic implementation is pretty simple, the software distortion layer and the head-tracking hook.

I'd love to see support added as I'm a big fan of Xonotic and the ability to "be in the game" that the Rift provides is seriously mind-blowing. I think a twitchy fast paced game like Xon is not super well suited for the Oculus but even being able to fly around in spectate mode would be seriously the shit.

A lot of developers have been implementing support for Oculus before getting their Dev kit (including the very popular Rollercoaster demo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9r50bcBuq0 ) but I understand it might be a frustrating experience.

If we ever do find a developer with access to the Dev Kit, or would like to take the plunge to attempt an implementation before receiving a Kit, I'd also like to add my name as someone who would be happy to provide testing and detailed feedback.

Edit: Oh, and by the way, other than the popular Oculus Dev Forums on MTBS3D ( http://www.mtbs3d.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=140 ), another great gathering place for Devs and enthusiasts alike with tons of awesome videos and information is the Oculus subreddit at http://www.reddit.com/r/oculus .
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#16
The current Xonotic devs certainly can't help with that.

Other projects use the DarkPlaces game engine, and the most complicated part of implementing rift support is through engine modification. Perhaps you can contact LordHavoc (author of the engine) and see if he has heard of anyone working on this.

We are currently not able to provide support in DarkPlaces or Xonotic, and I don't think there even is any desire at all in the Xonotic team to support VR hardware of any sort in the near future. I personally only see a gimmick in this, which can be fun to play with for a few minutes/hours but doesn't really fit a fast-paced FPS at all.
[Image:http://i.imgur.com/4XODR.png]640K ought to be enough for anybody.
     ― Linux Torvalds
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#17
If I don't throw up first. Going really fast on a device that already makes you sick by walking in Half Life 2. Is not a good idea!
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#18
I think it's a matter of habit. In addition, people react in different ways - in the beginning I get seasick for 10 minutes, and someone was able to play and dodge flying objects at him for over an hour. Gradually, I got used too, and doesn't have any problems with the VR.
But on the other hand - VR increases concentration and engagement in gameplay. It is becoming more diverse and look more realistic.
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#19
Guess I'm late to this thread. Personally, I don't own a dev kit, nor have I ever used one. But I occupied myself with Oculus Rift a lot in the last days.
In my opinion, this will not simply be a gimmick, it will revolutionize playing games because of two things it will provide:
1. "real" stereoscopic 3D.
2. almost full human field of view.

The big thing imo is the stereoscopic 3D. It'll make estimating distances very easy.
There are still a lot of downsides to the technology, but most of them will be fixed when the consumer version ships. I think so because of the support they get from big companies in the gaming industry.
Aside from the hardware downsides, I think the nauseating effects result mainly from bad implementation of the head tracking. Many people reported that kill cams, or loading screens cause nauseating effects.
Another thing I heard, and this might really make enabling arena shooters like Xonotic impossible, is people reporting they get motion sick from moving backwards or to the side. Though not everyone seems to have problems with that.
Also a lot of the movement patterns in arena shooters seem to be very non intuitive in VR. However, I feel some of this is a question of configuration of the movements.

Say rocket jumping: if the mouse doesn't to make the player look down, you could make a rocket jump while looking forward.
I think there are a lot of possibilities with this, even though a lot of hurdles too, obviously.

PS: Good job on Xonotic, found it just recently and it's really a lot of fun.
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#20
I don't think we'll ever see Xonotic getting its movement physics adapted to virtual reality.

Really, this is a debate of useability vs. "coolness". We want the game to be useable foremost, and I have yet to see a convincing argument on how VR can be implemented without negatively impacting useability (which is why I call it a gimmick).
[Image:http://i.imgur.com/4XODR.png]640K ought to be enough for anybody.
     ― Linux Torvalds
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#21
The point is we need to implement VR into Xonotic in order to find out how sick we'll get from all the hopping and racing around while actually sitting at our desks.

(Apologies for sarcasm)

On a serious note, VR can probably only be a proof of concept for Xonotic, which might be interesting for modding. But for the vanilla Xonotic gameplay I consider this useless.
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<ZeRoQL> i think i got 1 proper quad and that cunt halogen fuck me over with a laser
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#22
VR might be kinda neat, but it definitely wouldn't do much for the game in terms of playability. I mean outside of motion sickness what would it really do? Add the ability to look and aim in a different direction? I guess that might be kinda cool for vehicles, but I don't really think it would do much from a gameplay standpoint. Also, isn't stereoscopy already implemented in this game?

IF this were implemented, more than likely this would be the best way to have it work in game: tie the camera to your mouse look (like it currently is) and then add the ability to turn your head INDEPENDENTLY from where your gun is aimed. No auto-center or any of that implemented for when your gun moves either, if your still looking over your should in the real world, you will still be looking over your shoulder in the game even if you move your character's body and gun. That's really the only possible thing I can think of that head-tracking would add to the game.
ECKZBAWKZ HUGE LIST OF ACHIEVEMENTS GOES HERE....


Oh wait.
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#23
I agree that it wouldn't be an advantage to playing on a monitor, at least not in most cases, but I think with the right setup, it could be playable and fun. But I didn't join this forum to convince you to start implementing VR support. I just wanted you to keep an open mind and maybe think about how movement in an arena shooter could be done in VR.

Aiming and body movement being independent from view offers new ways to play games, but also comes with some design questions.

How could you implement bunny hopping for example. The camera would have to be totally independent from mouse movement, because otherwise you'd just get nauseous instantly.
So how'd you get back to the crosshair? Maybe a button to realign the body (crosshair) to the head position. In order to make quick turns, you'd have to be able to use your mouse though, so basically you'd need two different modes.

There's a quite informative video on some different movement systems valve has implemented into TF2 VR here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P50fvL_EWYY
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#24
If someone wants to implement this for fun, then by all means go ahead, and perhaps contact the team so that it can be made useful!

But for now I can't think of anyone who would have fun coding this, so it won't happen. Aside from being yet another contribution to the proof of concept list, there's no incentive to support VR in Xonotic.
[Image:http://i.imgur.com/4XODR.png]640K ought to be enough for anybody.
     ― Linux Torvalds
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#25
(09-12-2013, 12:20 PM)3del! Wrote: So how'd you get back to the crosshair?

You would simply turn your head back to where your gun is aimed. Your view would still shift if you moved the mouse (even if your not looking to where your crosshair is aimed) if that's what your wondering, you wouldn't have to continuously turn your head to keep it focused on where your aiming at if that's what your wondering, all you would have to do is keep it focused towards the crosshair.

(09-12-2013, 01:31 PM)Mr. Bougo Wrote: If someone wants to implement this for fun, then by all means go ahead, and perhaps contact the team so that it can be made useful!

But for now I can't think of anyone who would have fun coding this, so it won't happen. Aside from being yet another contribution to the proof of concept list, there's no incentive to support VR in Xonotic.

Agreed, it may add a small level of immersion as well as some serious motion sickness, but it wouldn't really do much for the game in my opinion so it's not really worth going out of the way for. I guess if someone got REALLY bored they can try to work on it.
ECKZBAWKZ HUGE LIST OF ACHIEVEMENTS GOES HERE....


Oh wait.
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