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Poll: Time limit for flag carriers?
This poll is closed.
Yes. I hate when flag carrier hides forever
20.00%
3 20.00%
No. Flag carriers never hide
60.00%
9 60.00%
I dont care.
20.00%
3 20.00%
Total 15 vote(s) 100%
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[SUGGESTION] Time limit for flag carrier

#1
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I've searched but i couldn't find any option like this, if it exists please tell me to delete this post.


One of the biggest problems with some CTF players is that they get the flag and then hide to never show up again even though his flag is in the base to cap. This is specially annoying when the map is big and there are only 4 or 6 players (teams of 2 or 3), so I was wondering if can be created an option (server side) to set a time limit to flag carriers. Of course this would be an optional command to set in the server.

For example a server might like to set "3 mins limit to cap or you'll die"
That way the flag carrier won't have the possibility to hide a lot of time.

Would be nice that once you get the flag a new clock shows up telling you the remaining time to cap.
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#2
And what if there is just a good fight between some teams and a guy can hold it for 3 minutes? He dies and the other team gets an easy capture.
You could only make a time limit to capture while the other team does not hold the flag.

Actually this does not happen soooo much, just teamkill people who are afk and have the flag Tongue
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#3
(10-20-2010, 07:57 PM)Mirio Wrote: Actually this does not happen soooo much, just teamkill people who are afk and have the flag Tongue

Some of the servers set teamkill off so you can't frag the fc of your team. Also some times the one with the flag is a noob that don't know what to do and is only hiding without reading what you tell him, etc.

(10-20-2010, 07:57 PM)Mirio Wrote: And what if there is just a good fight between some teams and a guy can hold it for 3 minutes? He dies and the other team gets an easy capture.
You could only make a time limit to capture while the other team does not hold the flag.

Yeah, I only said "3 mins" as an example it can be 4 or 5. also the command would be "optional" just as is optional to set teamkill off, or minsta + hook on, etc, then you, as server admin, would set the amount of time you think is the best.

I usually play in minsta + hook servers and flag carriers hiding are quite usual, you can be searching 10 mins for the flag carrier without finding him and its really annoying.

One more thing, most of the servers set 20 mins limit for the match. If a server sets for example 5 mins to cap then it wont be a problem since every cap takes less than 2 mins.
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#4
This is usually when the map has a flawed design that allows for hiding. However, with hook CTF, there is increased possibility of this happening. I remember when I played hook CTF on the herforst server years ago and we used to hide underneath the map in one of the indentations. That slowed gameplay down quite a bit.

If the player is managing to hold onto the flag without hiding, then the teams are probably unbalanced.

In the interest of allowing plenty of options through cvars, let's consider this for a second...
- What would happen after the 3 minute mark?
- Would they be forced to drop the flag?
- Could they pick it back up?
- Would they have to wait until the enemy flag is returned before they can grab it again?
- Would there be a countdown or warning before the flag is auto-dropped?
- Would it warn the other teammates too so they can come pick it up?
- Could the flag carrier drop the flag at the 2:59 mark and pick it back up to reset the timer?
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#5
What about making him somehow visible to the enemies after 3 minutes?
I mean: After 3 minutes being the flag picked up by enemies, the enemy flagcarrier would start to be spoted in the map with a visible title over his head (as the flagcarrier of your own team). Thus knowing the location, no one could hide. The most he could do is to avoid being killed moving and killing (and this is what I think is the purpose).
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#6
A fixed time cutoff is always a bit unfair.

Why not something "continous"?

Like... what if flag carrier gets a health rot (and no regen at all) while holding the flag? He then has to move and pick up health, or he'll slowly die (maybe drop 1% health every 2 sec, he then has more than 3 minutes when starting at 100, also it should be possible to compensate for this by picking up health packs in normal gameplay).
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#7
(10-20-2010, 11:48 PM)forseti Wrote: I usually play in minsta + hook servers and flag carriers hiding are quite usual, you can be searching 10 mins for the flag carrier without finding him and its really annoying.
Map knowledge is the key in CTF Tongue

(10-20-2010, 11:48 PM)forseti Wrote: One more thing, most of the servers set 20 mins limit for the match. If a server sets for example 5 mins to cap then it wont be a problem since every cap takes less than 2 mins.

That does not make sense if both teams got the flag and one is hiding for 10 minutes as you said Wink

(10-21-2010, 12:44 AM)Dokujisan Wrote: This is usually when the map has a flawed design that allows for hiding. However, with hook CTF, there is increased possibility of this happening. I remember when I played hook CTF on the herforst server years ago and we used to hide underneath the map in one of the indentations. That slowed gameplay down quite a bit.

But usually someone looked under the map too. Smile


(10-21-2010, 12:44 AM)Dokujisan Wrote: If the player is managing to hold onto the flag without hiding, then the teams are probably unbalanced.

1 example: Hydronex. If both teams got the flag it can take ages to get the flag back, because there is so much health. I'm one of those mofos who can hold the flag for minutes, so it would not really fair to me if I die after X minutes and lose the flag when I fight so hard for it before.

Actually, I like Grunts idea of the waypoint after X minutes.

Another idea: If the guy who has got the flag does not move and he is able to capture, he should get damage if he does not move like in LMS and after some time he would die.


Anyway.. like Doku mentioned. There are so many factors that need to be considered and maybe some work to code it. I think its not needed, because it really does not happen every single match that anyone does not capture. I would prefer to see the "F3 cheat" thing to get fixed. But well I would pick Grunts idea I guess or mine with the damage for not moving if only 1 team got the flag. Losing the flag after fighting for it would suck.
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#8
(10-21-2010, 03:11 AM)Grunt Wrote: What about making him somehow visible to the enemies after 3 minutes?

That is a cool idea too, just as in key hunt that the key carriers are always visible would be good if after certain time the flag carrier becomes visible to everyone, then the team would have to protect the flag carrier more.

Thinking in this new idea I will answer some of the doku's questions

- Would they be forced to drop the flag?
No,
The flag carrier would only become visible

- Would there be a countdown or warning before the flag is auto-dropped?
With this idea of becoming visible yes, they would get a warning before becoming visible.

- Could the flag carrier drop the flag at the 2:59 mark and pick it back up to reset the timer?
No, they would be able to drop the flag but the timer wouldn't be reseted.
The timer would be global, i mean it would work for all the team. If the fc dies and someone else in the team picks the flag up he would be visible too.
The timer would be then visible for all the team, then they would hurry up too to get his flag back to be able to cap.

This would make the game more active because teams would have to be protecting the flag carrier more than ever.
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#9
There is no "NO!!!" option! yes they hide sometimes, but i like that Big Grin
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#10
Not a fan of this idea I see it used in urban terror and don't think it would be needed for Xonotic.
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#11
IMHO the anti camp system enforced on the flag carrier would be the best.
nowego [MLP:FiM]
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#12
Flagcarriers do hide, and it can get me angry, but I don't think it should be banned. It's a tactic like an other, so I hunt the pussy down.
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#13
The anti camp system is even bad in LMS, as it often hurts someone who is not camping at all... I'd even propose replacing it in LMS, if anyone has an idea on how to do it better.

That is why I suggested a continuous health drain instead. Has basically the same effect (as anyone who roams around will get health packs), but also enforces passing the flag in some cases (a FC then can't simply hide and let his health recover on its own). The problem is, this won't be applicable to Minsta CTF.
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#14
(10-22-2010, 01:57 AM)divVerent Wrote: The anti camp system is even bad in LMS, as it often hurts someone who is not camping at all... I'd even propose replacing it in LMS, if anyone has an idea on how to do it better.

That is why I suggested a continuous health drain instead. Has basically the same effect (as anyone who roams around will get health packs), but also enforces passing the flag in some cases (a FC then can't simply hide and let his health recover on its own). The problem is, this won't be applicable to Minsta CTF.

Could add a campfire mutator similar to what was in UC2 lol Basically it's a timer that constantly ticks down and in order to buy time you have to get out and grab some frags. If the timer reaches 0 you explode damaging and/or fragging anybody that gets caught in it's blast. Picking up a flag in CTF could also buy time.
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#15
Lee_Stricklin: actually a nice idea and would work for LMS too. For CTF it could be activated only while holding the flag.

Taoki, something to code for you Wink
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#16
Why not just make the lights around the flag carrier bigger / bleed through walls? If the flag carrier is hiding in a corner with a 2 - 3 foot red/blue hue around them, then they aren't gonna stay hidden very long..
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#17
(10-22-2010, 03:18 AM)Lee_Stricklin Wrote: Could add a campfire mutator similar to what was in UC2 lol Basically it's a timer that constantly ticks down and in order to buy time you have to get out and grab some frags. If the timer reaches 0 you explode damaging and/or fragging anybody that gets caught in it's blast. Picking up a flag in CTF could also buy time.

And what if the other team is that clever that they just do not attack so the FC can not get frags? And if you get time for picking up you could drop it and pick it up again right? Wink
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#18
Time limit is bad, what if there's a cross cap?
Could instead try something interesting though... What if your own flag doesn't have to be in the base in order to cap?
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#19
(10-22-2010, 07:30 AM)FruitieX Wrote: Could instead try something interesting though... What if your own flag doesn't have to be in the base in order to cap?

That might be OK for games in maxed servers, but not for games with only a few people on both teams. CTF will be then closer to CTS (i.e. who can move the fastest) and make fighting skill/strategy less important.
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#20
Couldn't there be a mutation that would make it like Last Man Standing? In LMS, if you hide for a certain amount of time, you start to lose life until you die or move to another location.
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