Graphics: Xonotic VS Nexuiz [WARNING: OFFTOPIC]

I was bored, so I did a comparison.



Pretty neat, eh? I'm sure everyone knows that Xonotic graphics quality is better from Nexuiz's, but it's always nice to see same scene comparison with a single view.

Edit: Effect settings were "Ultra" on both games.

What I really noticed was the difference in quality between the two nex models

Xonotic runs A LOT better too, hell I still have my Nexuiz install capped at 46fps. However I'm able to run Xonotic at 60+ with some more eyecandy even. On top of that there have been many more advanced options added for those that like to get their hands dirty and fine tune their games. You want to see a major graphics improvement, then take a look at Stormkeep. The Xonotic version has a TON more eyecandy in it and retains mostly the same art style from Nexuiz.

Xonotic is awesome, everyone here knows this

I never cared about in-game graphics at all since I play on mostly lowest settings, but the HUD on the second screenshot is terrible. I don't like the nexuiz one too much either (the huge background panel especially), but this just blows. I'd rather play without the HUD than be forced to look at these fugly health/armor bars, fonts and retarded huge crosshairs. Talking about crosshairs, why were THEY changed anyway?

Xonotic is awesome, everyone here knows this

I agree, many people here tend to have a weird definition of awesome.

Xonotic is awesome, everyone here knows this

I agree, many people here tend to have a weird definition of awesome.
[/quote]

Brilliant, happy?

I never cared about in-game graphics at all since I play on mostly lowest settings, but the HUD on the second screenshot is terrible. I don't like the nexuiz one too much either (the huge background panel especially), but this just blows. I'd rather play without the HUD than be forced to look at these fugly health/armor bars, fonts and retarded huge crosshairs. Talking about crosshairs, why were THEY changed anyway?

Xonotic is awesome, everyone here knows this

I agree, many people here tend to have a weird definition of awesome.

Eh, I like it. The bars give you a quick visual on how you are i think instead of having to read numbers or look at the colors. I like this hud over the previous xonotic one.

Eh, I like it. The bars give you a quick visual on how you are i think instead of having to read numbers or look at the colors.

I'm complaining about the way the bars are done, not about the concept of having them in general. Two horribly blurred interlaced rectangles that look completely unrealated to the rest of the HUD serve as health bars? No thanks, I'd rather read numbers and look at colors. Oh wait no, I'd rather just look at colors I guess, the font is eyecancer. Also positions of the timer and scores are very awkward, why are they so off the top? It looks weird and distracting. The radar/minimap is a huge waste of space, and console notifications which it would get covered by will make it even less useful. I have yet to see where the teamhud (or whatever the area where CTF flags and such are placed is called) is so I can bitch about it too.

I like this hud over the previous xonotic one.

The previous HUD was much worse in terms of clutter and sucked too, but at least it looked somewhat complete.

Eh, I like it. The bars give you a quick visual on how you are i think instead of having to read numbers or look at the colors.

I'm complaining about the way the bars are done, not about the concept of having them in general. Two horribly blurred interlaced rectangles that look completely unrealated to the rest of the HUD serve as health bars? No thanks, I'd rather read numbers and look at colors. Oh wait no, I'd rather just look at colors I guess, the font is eyecancer. Also positions of the timer and scores are very awkward, why are they so off the top? It looks weird and distracting. The radar/minimap is a huge waste of space, and console notifications which it would get covered by will make it even less useful. I have yet to see where the teamhud (or whatever the area where CTF flags and such are placed is called) is so I can bitch about it too.

I like this hud over the previous xonotic one.

The previous HUD was much worse in terms of clutter and sucked too, but at least it looked somewhat complete.

I'm sorry, but most of the people prefers neat and good-looking graphics over simplicity and/or functionality. And IMO Xonotic HUD is functional and simple while it also offers eyecandy - overdoing is overdoing. I can't see the reason why are you complaining about the fonts.

[Complaints]

Well, good that everyone can configure most parts of the hud for himself. I don't know if the fonts can be replaced client-side easily, but honestly I don't think the font can be perceived as so terrible that it ruins the entire HUD. As for the other things they should be configurable, or am I wrong?

I sense a strong urge to get flamed at in your posts as they are so full of strong negative words. I am very happy that this hasn't happened yet and hope this will stay that way.

[Complaints]

Well, good that everyone can configure most parts of the hud for himself. I don't know if the fonts can be replaced client-side easily, but honestly I don't think the font can be perceived as so terrible that it ruins the entire HUD. As for the other things they should be configurable, or am I wrong?

I sense a strong urge to get flamed at in your posts as they are so full of strong negative words. I am very happy that this hasn't happened yet and hope this will stay that way.

Amen.

And IMO default settings should be suitable for the basic player, which usually pays attention to the graphics etc. One of the best things on Xonotic is that you can configure almost everything if you don't like default settings. However, we can't expect that every Xonotic player is HC-gamer or geek who wants to configure everything. Default settings should be suitable for everyone and if you don't like it - edit it. Simple.

Edit: I think the best way to create programs and games is to make them "suitable and usable for everyone, but also embrace geeks". And Xonotic should be like this.

I'm sorry, but most of the people prefers neat and good-looking graphics over simplicity and/or functionality.

Simplicity and functionality can be beautiful. This HUD offers neither functionality, nor eyecandy. It may be considered simple compared to the previous one, but that's about it.

Xonotic HUD is functional and simple while it also offers eyecandy.

I have already explained (or at least tried to explain) why this is not true in my previous post.

I can't see the reason why are you complaining about the fonts.

Ugly black borders and awkward thin shape of characters are enough to make it look bad and out of place. Compare it with Nexuiz HUD numeric font: soft shadows instead of wide borders, properly shaped characters and a nice-looking texture. It would be a lie to say Xonotic font is an improvement.

I'm sorry, but most of the people prefers neat and good-looking graphics over simplicity and/or functionality.

Simplicity and functionality can be beautiful. This HUD offers neither functionality, nor eyecandy. It may be considered simple compared to the previous one, but that's about it.

Xonotic HUD is functional and simple while it also offers eyecandy.

I have already explained (or at least tried to explain) why this is not true in my previous post.

I can't see the reason why are you complaining about the fonts.

Ugly black borders and awkward thin shape of characters are enough to make it look bad and out of place. Compare it it with Nexuiz HUD numeric font: soft shadows instead of wide borders, properly shaped characters and a nice-looking texture. It would be a lie to say Xonotic font is an improvement.

I'm afraid that I have to disagree with you.

Well, good that everyone can configure most parts of the hud for himself.

I was waiting for someone to point this out. I'm sorry for using strong negative words here, but you can't make crap smell better by dragging it around. Sure, I can come up with a better position for the panels, but the elements of which they consists of (icons, fonts, background, bars, etc.) will always look unintegrated and out of place, no matter where they are positioned. But of course, I can "configure" that too; I can replace the icons, replace or get rid of the backgrounds, probably will have to remove progressbar graphics (since I haven't seen an option to disable them), maybe find a better font or even stuff Nexuiz's one in a TTF, etc. etc. Yes, I can go through all this trouble to make the game look less of an eyecancer, but why do I have to?

Yes, I can go through all this trouble to make the game look less of an eyecancer, but why do I have to?

As long as you're the only one who complains about this, you'll have to face the direction the HUD is going I fear. It is however good that you pointed out your concerns (even though using slightly inappropriate language), so if others feel like you do then they can - and should - speak up here as well.

Since most of your concerns are basically a matter of taste which cannot be rationally argued about, it will be difficult to promote a change in these aspects if there aren't quite some more people who strongly dislike the current HUD.

I for one don't dislike it.

Edit: maybe you can come up with a demo graphic made in some image manipulation program how the HUD would look better or even best in your opinion? That would be rather constructive.

Got a problem with the HUD? Then tweak it in the player options, or grab one from the following thread. Also you can disable the progress bars (well except for fuel maybe).
http://forums.xonotic.org/showthread.php?tid=1339

As long as you're the only one who complains about this, you'll have to face the direction the HUD is going I fear.

I am also the only one to make a point in this thread. All of my concerns have been responded with either "no, you're wrong, I like the HUD", "you can customize it" or have been simply ignored. I didn't even expect a change to the HUD to begin with, I started posting here fully realizing that nobody will care about my opinion already, but I'd at least like to know why do you guys think this HUD is so great, what's so "functional" about it and where the "eyecandy" is.

if others feel like you do then they can - and should - speak up here as well.

Unfortunately for you, others who feel like I am gave up on Xonotic already and simply keep playing That Other Game. You won't get them to switch at this rate.

Edit: maybe you can come up with a demo graphic made in some image manipulation program how the HUD would look better or even best in your opinion? That would be rather constructive.

I am not a graphic artist, I can only rate the current HUD and suggest changes from a user's point of view, and not a designer's. The closest thing to this I can do is to suggest an alternative placement for the HUD panels, but like I said already, it won't LOOK any better no matter what.

exec hud_nexuiz.cfg... also what is your main gripe about the HUD again? Font? Easily disabled progress bars? A mock up would be nice.

It seems that the only acceptable action in your point of view is to remake the HUD according to your subjective opinion, which boils down to "not like that". Great.

Interestingly, for several years now, when it comes to actually creating something better, (almost) everyone leaves the room quietly through the back door...

exec hud_nexuiz.cfg

In case you haven't noticed, I am not looking for a HUD replacement. I even stated that I'm not a huge fan of the Nexuiz HUD too, but I have to say that config throws away the best of the original Nexuiz HUD and adopts the worst. Nice numeric font is gone, but the waste-of-space bottom panel that I have disabled the first day I started playing the game is in, yay! In addition to brand-new screwups like the oversized clock, misplaced weapon list (it overlaps with the bottom panel) and horribly stretched background of the scores panel. But this is irrelevant.

... also what is your main gripe about the HUD again? Font? Easily disabled progress bars?

Font, progress bars, position and sizes of certain elements (such as the timer, scores and radar) and very bright distracting borders on HUD panels. For details, refer to my previous posts, I have explained what exactly is wrong with most of these. See, I answered your question. Now please answer mine for once:

why do you guys think this HUD is so great, what's so "functional" about it and where the "eyecandy" is.

It seems that the only acceptable action in your point of view is to remake the HUD according to your subjective opinion

No. The only acceptable action in my point of view is to post and explain your own opinion on the current HUD, at least we will understand eachother better and maybe will even agree on a compromise. This is the way to improve things.

All of my concerns have been responded with either "no, you're wrong, I like the HUD", "you can customize it" or have been simply ignored.

What did you expect? All you said boils down to "it's ugly", or, at least, "I don't like it". How to argue rationally about that? How should people possibly react?

I'd bet in any other gaming forum you'd have been immediately heavily flamed.

If I missed a point besides the "I don't like it", please elaborate.

Edit: Oh, you did. Ok. From the current HUD I like the following:

the numeric font is very clear, not so thick and therefore more easily readable, at least for me. I don't mind soft shadowing or black border, but the black border does not have any negative impact from my point of view. I usually don't use the map at all so I don't mind how it is done. The HUD borders I like very much, since they go well with the overall techie design of the game and don't take away too much of the game scene behind them. Especially since they fade out to the corners of the screen so they don't obscure more than necessary. Having all the relevant information in the center lower area is also an improvement since you don't need to frenetically search for the information you need all across the bottom line. And they are placed where it is most unlikely they'd obscure an opponent. The background of the HUD improves visibility of the font as well as leaves the world behind the HUD visible too, in my humble opinion perfect for being able to get the information if you look for it and blinding out the HUD mentally when concentrating on your surrounding. The slimmer font helps in that respect too. I never minded the progress bars at all since I actually didn't knowingly read them so far.

That's what I think about the current HUD. I hope it helps you?

you realize you can scale things on the hud? and change the colors? literally, most of your complaints can be fixed by customizing the HUD to your own tastes.

so go fix it

I believe we're getting a bit off topic here, so let me bring this back to the subject of the first post in this thread: Exitium, I think this is a great comparison. By any chance would you be interested in doing more of these with some other maps/models/etc? I would be interested in writing a blog post about it for the front page.

Let me know!

I can also do sth with it. For example: Movie compering this two games. Ofc after doing "Raise of the Phoenix" project.

* Nesquick is naked.