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[SUGGESTION] Weapons function

ok so the hagar primary is a combo of mg and and mortar . it is less likely used weapon of all . i know in xonotic the secondary got improved and acts like a ( get out of my face type gun ) with its flare distraction action. what if the hagar primary used proximity mines at a slow refire rate . these mines could stick to walls , ceilings etc . not sure about team based or friendly fire type recognition . this would be like setting little traps . i know you are probably thinking " this acts like the electro balls " but you cant shoot them to make them detonate or use 2 or 3 like the electro because other proximity mines cannot occupy the same space , they detect each other , cutting down the spammers. this could maybe be the mortar secondary . or i could be drunk typing
anyway . i thought the mines idea might be a neat addition
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How would you disarm them if you can't shoot them?

Yeah, that's a bad idea. Turning the electro into a sticky grenade gun is a better idea, I think. Use secondary to shoot sticky ball and primary to detonate it.
(07-18-2010, 10:59 AM)Flying Steel Wrote: How could anyone with ADHD tell its a high damage weapon if it wasn't a gigantic metal cock fucking the map whenever a player gets within 3 meters of a wall?

[Image: di-712770583645.png]

Sticking balls is going to make it VERY easy to spam and cover corridors imo, if that was to be put in place i'd make it not fire constantly secondary balls and make it charge or something.
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(06-13-2010, 03:47 PM)kojn^ Wrote: Sticking balls is going to make it VERY easy to spam and cover corridors imo, if that was to be put in place i'd make it not fire constantly secondary balls and make it charge or something.

Considering it's quick and easy to detonate balls with a laser, it's not an issue.
(07-18-2010, 10:59 AM)Flying Steel Wrote: How could anyone with ADHD tell its a high damage weapon if it wasn't a gigantic metal cock fucking the map whenever a player gets within 3 meters of a wall?

[Image: di-712770583645.png]

Try balanceFruit.cfg in latest fruitiex/fruitbalance.

-Primary grenades are sticky now Tongue
-Electro primary acts as a (currently crappy) lightning gun, might charge up secondary blobs in the future if i get that working right.
-Laser primary is a gauntlet, whose range is adjusted by your speed. Later it'll maybe allow for small trickjumps.
- MG is starting weap, shotgun was bumped up
- RL remote detonation disabled

Lots of balancing is still needed, they are for sure unbalanced at the moment. They are just showing some of the ideas that have been brought up in this thread. Please give feedback/ideas Smile
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Wait, primary grenades are sticky? What about secondary? Everyone is used to primary grenades detonating on impact...
(07-18-2010, 10:59 AM)Flying Steel Wrote: How could anyone with ADHD tell its a high damage weapon if it wasn't a gigantic metal cock fucking the map whenever a player gets within 3 meters of a wall?

[Image: di-712770583645.png]

It's for a separate balance. balanceFruit.cfg isn't actually used as default.

sounds like quake

I wouldn't of made primary sticky, but i'm guessing you completely changed how the secondary work's so will probably atleast make it less like the current rocket launcher and electro all doing a similar thing. Will PM you on IRC would like to atleast try out the mortar!
[Image: 542.png]

#deathmatchers @ irc.quakenet.org


damn why you want rocket guidance off by default ?
I like hitting you from the corner Smile
you damn snipe mutant Tongue

(06-20-2010, 10:08 AM)FruitieX Wrote: -Primary grenades are sticky now Tongue

No, simply no.

Simply yes Tongue
Links to my: SoundCloud and bandcamp accounts

There surprisingly good fisume, I was surprised actually, still need damage/radius working on, but they are really very useful and don't fire too quickly.
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And are also really difficult to get used to.
Good thing XPM is not default, yeah? Tongue
(07-18-2010, 10:59 AM)Flying Steel Wrote: How could anyone with ADHD tell its a high damage weapon if it wasn't a gigantic metal cock fucking the map whenever a player gets within 3 meters of a wall?

[Image: di-712770583645.png]

Actually his current balance is something I have been helping to work on and NOT to have a seperate balance for XPM, to maybe suggest adding some of it as default, more a case of modifying the current weapons, so shotgun still starting weapon but so it's more like a shotgun, mg primary different and secondary different, crylink has been changed too so far both primary and secondary.

Crylink now is deadly very close but spreads out a lot further it goes - dmg needs to be increased slightly I think, requires some skill to take time and use though Smile speed of the shot may be slightly increased as is very slow at anything over mid distance. Secondary fires like a blaster style but with 4 bullets with each shot at the moment I think, you'll need to try hard to explain.

MG primary is now more like a chaingun in it's spread, but it also can be used for slightly longer distances, it goes through ammo quickly but it also deals damage quite fast, we may up this slightly as we tested it in a duel and it felt a little weak?

Secondary is like before, bigger spread though so you can't use it to snipe from insane distances and the dmg has been altered, much more balanced at the moment.


We found using the current physics it's actually not as hard as we thought to get close to an opponent, so something like a shotgun butt/swipe would be a cool secondary if it was able to be implemented to act as a melee weapon too, at the moment there is no secondary as it seems to cause problems with making it have a different firemode.

Have put in a few hours so far working on it, but still needs a lot more work with dmg tweaking but you can try out the current changes..but slowly getting there Smile
[Image: 542.png]

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(07-14-2010, 08:04 AM)kojn^ Wrote: Crylink now is deadly very close but spreads out a lot further it goes - dmg needs to be increased slightly I think, requires some skill to take time and use though Smile speed of the shot may be slightly increased as is very slow at anything over mid distance. Secondary fires like a blaster style but with 4 bullets with each shot at the moment I think, you'll need to try hard to explain.
The crylink was one of the few non-hitscan weapons that could prove effective at long ranges. By doing what you did to it, it becomes ineffective at long ranges and people complain that hitscan weapons are overused.

(07-14-2010, 08:04 AM)kojn^ Wrote: Secondary is like before, bigger spread though so you can't use it to snipe from insane distances and the dmg has been altered, much more balanced at the moment.
If the damage is lower, spread can be kept the same. One of the uses of MG secondary is to make snipers and campers hide.

(07-14-2010, 08:04 AM)kojn^ Wrote: We found using the current physics it's actually not as hard as we thought to get close to an opponent, so something like a shotgun butt/swipe would be a cool secondary if it was able to be implemented to act as a melee weapon too, at the moment there is no secondary as it seems to cause problems with making it have a different firemode.
Off hand melee usable with any weapon would be the best.
(07-18-2010, 10:59 AM)Flying Steel Wrote: How could anyone with ADHD tell its a high damage weapon if it wasn't a gigantic metal cock fucking the map whenever a player gets within 3 meters of a wall?

[Image: di-712770583645.png]

Strangely enough, I agree with everything Roanoke just said. Smile

If you both just playtest your balance in DM duels on the usual DM close-quarters-combat maps, you'll end up balancing down the effective ranges of the weapons so that the Nex becomes even more unstoppable on any normal non-DM map.

If you implement melee, you will be gods.
(04-01-2010, 11:21 AM)Roanoke Wrote: Yes, beveled edges are more futuristic. Like BSG and their beveled paper.
But only on one edge.

(07-14-2010, 01:26 PM)Flying Steel Wrote: Strangely enough, I agree with everything Roanoke just said. Smile
Oh my god!

(07-14-2010, 01:26 PM)Flying Steel Wrote: If you implement melee, you will be gods.
Yes, particularly if it is implemented well.
(07-18-2010, 10:59 AM)Flying Steel Wrote: How could anyone with ADHD tell its a high damage weapon if it wasn't a gigantic metal cock fucking the map whenever a player gets within 3 meters of a wall?

[Image: di-712770583645.png]

Roanoke, did you even try any of the changes or just comment and quote what I have written??

First things first, we still need to tweak the crylink and mg, but as for now, the primary of the crylink is meant to be slower then the secondary but the speed of the primary needs to be increased still I think, but will do a lot of damage if you hit someone close, also it ricochets well around corners.

Secondary still needs to be tweaked, but atleast they are useable.

Secondary of the crylink can be used for long ranges, I mean your idea of long range is probably one end of facing worlds to the other.

Do you just want to make every weapon really quick, where's the balance then?

Having a mg secondary that 'forces campers and snipers to hide' as you so elegantly put it..the mg secondary as it currently is in nexuiz was the cause of so many complaints about it's strength on open ctf maps.

There is the RL that is faster now that can be fired, also use crylink secondary to shoot at snipers/campers, and you can still use the mg secondary to hit people its just not as effective at super-long ranges which means you won't be getting mowed down by the mg, and can atleast get closer to use other weapons more effectively.

As for the nex, we haven't got round to balancing that yet, will also work on the camping rifle.

The best thing would be for you to join me and FrutieX on the server and play on suitable maps, or some of the maps like implosion and test the range out, otherwise I get the feeling no matter what change is done your just going to knock back anything any one comes up with.

Oh and for the record, we didn't just try it out on a tight close-quarter DM maps, we did some range testing too so far, like I said before we didn't spend 15 minutes doing this latest stuff, we spent a whole evening doing it, and I mean a whole evening.
[Image: 542.png]

#deathmatchers @ irc.quakenet.org


When and where are you testing this? I'd volounteer to participate in testing, even though I hardly can promise definite times when I am available for that. But it would be nice to know where to find you IF I find some time.
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What could really help the range balance is if you made all hit-scan weapons have considerable enough spread to make them no more or not much more effective at long ranges than the slow traveling but precise projectile weapons.

With the Nex, if you didn't want to give it any spread, you could make it a 'sustained beam' which you have to hold on your enemy for a long time to do considerable damage. Now that would be fair for once and very unique versus other games' sniper weapons. And not to mention make it more unique versus the Rifle that competes with it.
(04-01-2010, 11:21 AM)Roanoke Wrote: Yes, beveled edges are more futuristic. Like BSG and their beveled paper.
But only on one edge.

Just be on IRC any evening, quakenet.org network and #xonotic main channel you can find me and frutiex there, just ask one of us and we can set something up and you can join in and help test, and we can explain why we've changed what and the dmg settings to making it balanced.

Flying Steel, your welcome to join in too.

Also, we took tZork's settings for the mg and we have worked on it so that the mg primary is more useful now low-medium distance fights, whilst the secondary is mainly only good for medium/long and so that it doesn't overpower the primary at close range, this is how we've stopped it being so effective at long ranges.

We have tried to do the same with the crylink too, primary you need to be close for it to the most damage but you can also use it around corners really well now to deal a bit of damage, still got to work on refire rate, dmg and speed tweaks still but we like what we have for now, secondary that was something frutiex did quickly after a suggestion from myself, still needs work but it's pretty cool.

As for the nex, your idea sounds similar to the lightning gun that frutiex made for the electro primary but not sure? (was originally meant to be for XPM), so not sure if electro will stay as a LG or not in these settings but certainly it needs to be different to how it is now, as otherwise it'll be the same as the current RL in the balance.

Also the shotgun is pretty good really close, but you need to take your time with it, no more spray and praying you need some aim to atleast do some damage but hopefully we made the balance of it good so far, hopefully you can come and test with us in a little game and see what you think and give some feedback.
[Image: 542.png]

#deathmatchers @ irc.quakenet.org


(07-15-2010, 06:37 AM)kojn^ Wrote: The best thing would be for you to join me and FrutieX on the server and play on suitable maps, or some of the maps like implosion and test the range out, otherwise I get the feeling no matter what change is done your just going to knock back anything any one comes up with.
Okay, when? Usually when I am on IRC you are not.
(07-18-2010, 10:59 AM)Flying Steel Wrote: How could anyone with ADHD tell its a high damage weapon if it wasn't a gigantic metal cock fucking the map whenever a player gets within 3 meters of a wall?

[Image: di-712770583645.png]

And where? What's the server address (or name if it's public)?

Also will Nex 2.5.2 work or would I need to git and compile?
(04-01-2010, 11:21 AM)Roanoke Wrote: Yes, beveled edges are more futuristic. Like BSG and their beveled paper.
But only on one edge.



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