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[DUEL] Tuhma

#1
[Image: geR1ORL.jpg]

More Screen shots: http://imgur.com/a/9knHc
Download: https://www.dropbox.com/s/y27vcx9sgwnbme...1.pk3?dl=0

An urban themed map with both duel and 2v2 made in mind and it is somewhat the size of Final rage. The map has both strength and shield powerups. All the custom textures are my creations, with the exception of the ArenaFPS logo (courtesy of ArenaFPS team) and Zlive poster (courtesy of Zlive team). Whiskies cat sprite from 2GD studio logo (courtesy of 2GD himself). The "drowned" icon is from the HUD. 
  • Vortex and Devastator have a respawn time of 30 sec, because it takes a bit longer to materialize in a moist atmosphere Big Grin
  • You can speed through the crawlspaces if you enter them crouching and hold jump.
  • You can get to shield without splash weapons, I'll let you figure out how. Hint: it has something to do with jump skillz
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#2
This map looks cool!
Very good job with the overall map size and amazing level of details here, it creates a very urban atmosphere that reminds me some UT99 or even Warsow maps. It needs a few ambient sounds for an even greater atmosphere!  
I like some of the ideas, like putting Vortex and Devastator in liquids (good thing that the Vortex is so exposed).
There are a lot of possible trickjump scenarios, as you showed me in-game (some of them being really advanced Big Grin ).

The maps needs optimization though. I had some FPS drops while running around, and I could hear my GPU fan suffering :>

I still need to play a real game on it, will let you know if I have more feedback.
Stats | Maps: CTF: disarray, vinegar, metro DM: labyrinth Duel: cucumber, quark.
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#3
This map looks great and the attention to detail is far above average. As SpiKe already said, the FPS suffer in some spots, especially on the top platform (the one that you can reach with the jumppad).

I can't say too much about the gameplay as I have not played a real match on it, but the layout feels pretty nice. The room with the shield seems a bit disconnected from the rest of the map, but that is not necessarily a bad thing.
The shield is quite hard to reach, even with splash weapons, so that will be an interesting spot. I guess to reach it without splash weapons is by using the street lamps.
I'm a bit surprised to see both strengh and shield as this map is rather small.


Is there actually a way into the tuhma district bunker? The posters imply it, but I have not managed to get in Sad

I've put the map on the EAC servers
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#4
A really cool map, nice work!
Great detailing and many easter eggs to discover Big Grin

A couple of cents:

[Image: 687Yd4nm.jpg]
I came along this dead end. Just let me jump through please.

[Image: 6Ra53pAm.jpg]
I consider this a problematic dead end too. I know it is possible to jump out of it and managed it two times. But since this is not a "Git Gud" XDF map, the trickjump could be easier and more fluid.

[Image: Pz7mDcwm.jpg]
The ceiling clips are quite low and make the map feel cramped. They also make it more difficult to use the blaster to jump to the vortex.

[Image: iCe9bAIm.jpg]
[Image: ji42r4gm.jpg]
In terms of performance, it works fine on my dated system. However, hinting (vis) could be improved. In the two screenshots, you can see that in a place that is reasonably isolated, the engine nevertheless renders the entire map. Triangles can be shown with:

Code:
r_showtris 1
r_speeds 1
r_showdisabledepthtest 1
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#5
(05-18-2017, 05:27 PM)Freddy Wrote: This map looks great and the attention to detail is far above average. As SpiKe already said, the FPS suffer in some spots, especially on the top platform (the one that you can reach with the jumppad).

I can't say too much about the gameplay as I have not played a real match on it, but the layout feels pretty nice. The room with the shield seems a bit disconnected from the rest of the map, but that is not necessarily a bad thing.
The shield is quite hard to reach, even with splash weapons, so that will be an interesting spot. I guess to reach it without splash weapons is by using the street lamps.
I'm a bit surprised to see both strengh and shield as this map is rather small.


Is there actually a way into the tuhma district bunker? The posters imply it, but I have not managed to get in Sad

I've put the map on the EAC servers
Performance was my first worry and it's actually a subject I could use some help with. I don't have that much experience with mapping, so if you have any ideas to improve the map I'd appreciate it!

There's 4 entrances to shield room, but only 3 ways out and all of them are kind of tricky. It's one huge death trap basically, so you need to make a swift decision to get out of there. In the other hand, it can also be a very safe space if you prepare a good vantage point and an escape route.

I could not decide which powerup to put in so I ended up putting both, probably doesn't hurt to have at least one map like this lol. I'm expecting some good frag runs on FFA/TDM Wink

You're not the only one who's been denied the warmth and safety of the bunker. Feel free to grab a spray can and write your criticism on the blast door (somebody already beat you to it though).
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#6
Thanks for your input and time, really appreciate it. I'm glad you bring up few of these things, because it gives me the opportunity to talk about the design decisions I made:

(05-18-2017, 06:13 PM)sev Wrote: [Image: Pz7mDcwm.jpg]
The ceiling clips are quite low and make the map feel cramped. They also make it more difficult to use the blaster to jump to the vortex.

Conscious decision, this was partially to save some texturing work (for all the areas that would become visible) and is kind of unnecessary to have that space too because you can make that jump without blaster too. Either with the speed of the jump pad, the speed of the tele exit or a simple circle jump. And if your circle jump is not good enough, then lead with an extra jump. It's doable with practice.

(05-18-2017, 06:13 PM)sev Wrote: [Image: 6Ra53pAm.jpg]
I consider this a problematic dead end too. I know it is possible to jump out of it and managed it two times. But since this is not a "Git Gud" XDF map, the trickjump could be easier and more fluid.
I made it a dead end like that, so there would be some delay between picking up 100a and mega health (across the teleporter). The risk of going in there also reflects the value of the item you get Wink The gid gud XDF jump was not intentional, but if it works then it works. I don't want to make it easier to get out there for the delay reasons.

Same thing with the 50hp room. That opening is meant for your opponent to fry your buttocks if you retreat into that room for the 50hp. It was originally open, but it felt like it made some other routes more redundant - so I ended up clipping it. Don't underestimate the 50hp's value though, there aren't quite that many HP across the map.

(05-18-2017, 06:13 PM)sev Wrote: In terms of performance, it works fine on my dated system. However, hinting (vis) could be improved.
I'm little green with mapping and I could use some guidance in here, optimizing the map is my primary goal.

Again, thanks for your lengthy post!
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#7
I can see your reasoning about the armor dead end. And you are right, it is quite easy to jump to the vortex from the jumppad, so this is not a huge issue.
 
While an open sky can cause mapping trouble, low clipping is not a particularly elegant solution. In general, obstructions are fine, but they should not be invisible.
In the control room, you could for example rearrange the monitors to more clearly obstruct the exit:
[Image: vLoojPYm.jpg]
 
I'm a bit rusty on the subject of portals, hints, and visibility. These look like some decent explanations:
http://openarena.wikia.com/wiki/Mapping_...nt_brushes
http://www.quake3world.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3620
 
In general, it is beneficial to inspect the generated portals, which should be an option/plugin in NetRadiant.
 
Also, I recommend to record a demo with bots where you visit all places. With the timedemo command, you then get an objective performance measurement, which can be used to see the effect of hinting changes. Though you don't need to micro-optimize the hints. Concentrating on some major corners/portals should be enough.
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#8
(05-18-2017, 06:25 PM)Smilecythe Wrote: There's 4 entrances to shield room, but only 3 ways out and all of them are kind of tricky. It's one huge death trap basically, so you need to make a swift decision to get out of there. In the other hand, it can also be a very safe space if you prepare a good vantage point and an escape route.

I could not decide which powerup to put in so I ended up putting both, probably doesn't hurt to have at least one map like this lol. I'm expecting some good frag runs on FFA/TDM Wink


We played some DM on it yesterday and the Shield room is a death trap indeed. It felt like the map has not enough spawns. Players kept respawning there all the time (has 2 spawns if I am not mistaken) and it is very easy to spawn kill with RL and the MH keeps you alive. Therefore you don't really have to leave this area to rack up kills. At least I abused this a lot.
For Duel this is probably fine, as the opponent often spawns in another room.

Personally I like the MA "trap" style and there is a trickjump out of it even. Also you can get out with the Blaster quickly, so I guess it is fine.

I agree with the "dead end room", it looks like you could go through it which makes it a bit weird. Maybe add a semi-broken window to it.

Nice work, especially the texture eastereggs all over the map. Wink
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#9
I had a quick duel on it yesterday and I really like this map for several reasons:

(1) The layout is very interesting, complex enough to totally confuse me but I managed to see a lot of route options everywhere. After getting to know this map's layout, this will offer a lot of variety.
(2) I like vertical action.
(3) Sooo many trickjumps that require some practice but at the same time actually are worth mastering them, so it's encouraging to learn them - win-win story in terms of fun and player skill development!
(4) Awesome looks. Very consistent theme, love the details!

As far as I am concerned, it's more "Mahtava" than "Tuhma" - excellent job!
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#10
Wow,

Very nice and cool map! Great

kwakkie
[Image: 39855.png]
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#11
Did not quite hit me, really. 
But absolutely loved exploring & reading all the stuff. This could be, like, a secret level in a single player campaign of some sort Big Grin Just add duke nukem strip club music behind one of the NAUGHTIEST OF THE DOORS!
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#12
I gotta say I'm very impressed by the textures and map layout. The vortex and devastator spots are really great. Overall an extremely interesting map (and the billboard signs made me chuckle)

However if there's one thing that bothers me more than anything, it's when the map makes it look like you can go somewhere that you can't (invisible walls and all). To an extent it's understandable, I mean, you have to draw a line somewhere. But it shouldn't be a guessing game of "can I go here?" and this is something that bothers me greatly about Erbium in particular (another amazing map).

For your map, it's the upper part and the 50hp room that bothers me. Put bars (or something more creative) in the 50 room so you can't jump through but you can shoot through.
Not sure what to do with that upper part but when I was up there it just seems like there was so much I should be able to jump on but couldn't.

With that said, this is a new map, so I'm sure this isn't the final product.
[Image: whpqyn.png]
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#13
Map walkthrough:

asyyy^ | are you releated to chuck norris?
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#14
Congratulations on a stunning map, Smilecythe! I very much like all the little funny jokes around the maps.

As an average player, I would also like less restrictions on height and access.


.jpg   platform.jpg (Size: 167.4 KB / Downloads: 88)

(05-18-2017, 06:25 PM)Smilecythe Wrote: Performance was my first worry and it's actually a subject I could use some help with. I don't have that much experience with mapping, so if you have any ideas to improve the map I'd appreciate it!

My rig isn't high end for gaming, but it's good enough for most maps. I did have low fps whenever facing this side:


.jpg   low_fps.jpg (Size: 166.41 KB / Downloads: 87)

I know you are aware of this. Just thought I'd let you know where the most resource hungry area is, should you want to prioritize your optimization (which i know nothing about) list.
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#15
Very nice looking map but it lags like hell. I got slowdowns to 60 fps. It's unplayable. Also I got trapped a lot in the part near the devastator. There is only one way to exit it without the blaster and it involves crouching. Noobs like me will get trapped to eternity there.
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#16
(06-09-2017, 10:30 AM)Lyberta Wrote: Very nice looking map but it lags like hell. I got slowdowns to 60 fps. It's unplayable. Also I got trapped a lot in the part near the devastator. There is only one way to exit it without the blaster and it involves crouching. Noobs like me will get trapped to eternity there.


As for the performance part, it seems the "window" which "seals" the area containing the nex gives these huge fps drops. Perhaps you have reflections turned on, try turning these off if so. 
I have to admit the map is a bit noob unfriendly. It's very confusing if you don't play it alot especially if you don't have that much experience in the game as some players here do. But what you're saying is not entirely true. You can exit the room with a little "trick"jump, though it isn't really a trick, it just requires you to use the slope correctly with a small nudge of your mouse hand.
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